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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 2:00 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:54 pm
Posts: 30
Pump me up wrote:
The accident was terrible. Condolences to the kiter involved and his family. A number of my posts have been critical of the aerodynamic and safety inferiority of ram air (foil) kites. Without wanting to use this man's terrible misfortune to score cheap political points, it is important to note that this man's accident was DIRECTLY attributable to the type of kite he was using - ie ram air. The requirement or temptation to do downwind launches with many ram air kites, eg Flysurfer, makes them inherently dangerous and less safe compared to inflatables. There are countless episodes where ram air riders have got into trouble because of launches in the middle of the window. Ram airs are less safe compared to inflatables and this tragic accident, once again, demonstrates this.


Your are a nasty piece of work who ever you are, using a near fatal accident as an excuse to troll your bullshit around. Why don't you go and tell that shit to the paralised guys family ? In any sane forum you would have been banned long ago... f u c k you and your mother.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 3:27 am 
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Joined: Wed May 27, 2009 2:50 pm
Posts: 201
I agree with you man!!!!!!! sometimes shit might just happen.. pulley break, bridal snap, give the guy a break and lets be positive and constructive and learn from this... not bash the poor guy out loud>>>> Peace


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:34 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 20, 2009 3:40 am
Posts: 6
Pump me up what the fuck is wrong with you? Using a paralyzed guy to preach your bullshit is just plain WRONG.

Someone should just ban this bastard or at least delete him from this thread.

I hope the guy gets well soon. My condolences go out to his family.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:20 am 
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Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 3:38 am
Posts: 3327
Location: Malibu
Sorry to hear about another accident.
I hope he pulls through OK.
I wish him the best and hope his situation improves.
Many kiters around the world have their fingers cross for him.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 7:35 am 
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Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Tue May 24, 2005 3:38 am
Posts: 3327
Location: Malibu
Pump me up wrote:
The accident was terrible. Condolences to the kiter involved and his family. A number of my posts have been critical of the aerodynamic and safety inferiority of ram air (foil) kites. Without wanting to use this man's terrible misfortune to score cheap political points, it is important to note that this man's accident was DIRECTLY attributable to the type of kite he was using - ie ram air. The requirement or temptation to do downwind launches with many ram air kites, eg Flysurfer, makes them inherently dangerous and less safe compared to inflatables. There are countless episodes where ram air riders have got into trouble because of launches in the middle of the window. Ram airs are less safe compared to inflatables and this tragic accident, once again, demonstrates this.


Pump Me Up. Go over to a mirror and try to look yourself in the face and then think of how you are
trying to take advantage of this kiters tradgic situation. He is fighting to walk again while you are spreading your miss-information.

You posting show several things:
First of all your total lack of respect and integrity.
Second that you have some sort of personal problem with Flysurfer. No Flysurfer was involved in the accident but that's the only brand you mention.

Hopefully we can loook at this accident from a realistic point of view and all learn something,
stick together and collectively impove safety for all kites and kiters.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:26 am 
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Rare Poster

Joined: Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:09 am
Posts: 30
Location: Johannesburg, South Africa
It always saddens me to hear of accidents and injuries, my prayers are with the kiteboarder and his family.

PMU, you are a tosser...


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 8:32 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:43 am
Posts: 24
PMU, your an Asshat. :angryfire:


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 10:20 am 
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Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:33 pm
Posts: 910
Location: europe
what a stupid post, PMU
u should do the same, in all the other posts with LEI accidents...which are countless.

i just hope that he will be fine again whatever the time , it takes.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 12:46 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 10, 2003 1:00 am
Posts: 691
Location: Huguenot Park, FL.
Accidents like this are terrible for the victim, the families and the kiteboarding community as a whole. I am sure we all wish him a speedy and full recovery.

The PMU posts are often designed to stir up bad feelings. But there may be some valuable information we can all gain from all our experiences. If we can get past the obvious venom PMU has for the ram-air designs we might be able to apply the lessons learned to future kiting and avoid similar incidents.

With exception of Peter Lynn kites ram air kites have an extremely flat shape. This means that a greater percentage of the wing is lifting and pulling at any moment. That is why they tend to produce more power for their size than c-shape or bow style kites. They also have a smooth skin on the bottom which eliminates drag. Because of this they are extremely efficient as air foils. This efficiency allows them to fly very close to the edge of the WW. Tube kites tend to sit back in the window a bit. The closer to the edge the WW a kite flies the more susceptible it can be to gusts and direction changes in the wind. For a tube kite this is a minor problem in most cases. Modern inflatable kites just change position as the wind changes velocity or direction. But for a ram air kite a sudden changes in velocity or direction have a much greater effect. Ram air kites need the constant pressure of wind (actual or apparent) to keep them inflated. If a ram air kite is caught up wind of the wind window it loses this pressure and begins to deflate. When this happens the wing can become deformed and stop flying. The more it deforms the further down wind it will drift until it either re-inflates or ends up as crumpled fabric dead down wind. Even experienced kiters can have a hard time controlling a kite that has drifted dead down wind. This is the factor that PMU is always harping about.

I do think that there may be a habit that ram air flyers might be likely to develop of launching dead down wind. Many people start out with small "trainer" kites which typically have to be launched in the power zone. As they progress to larger kites they might tend to still launch them the same way. Tube kite flyers learn quickly that that wont work for that type of kite. Ram air kiters may get away with it for a while. But launching down wind is potentially dangerous in stronger conditions. I have seen 180 pound guys snatched violently downwind in 25 mph winds by 2.5 meter kites. it can be avoided. I have yet to see a kite that cant be launched near the edge of the wind window. Even small trainer kites can be launched this way. It just take a bit of practice and patience. It might be a good idea to take the time on a steady light wind day to learn and practice this type of launching.


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 Post subject: Re: Near fatal accident at sandbanks, poole
PostPosted: Thu Sep 03, 2009 4:12 pm 
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Medium Poster

Joined: Tue May 20, 2003 7:01 am
Posts: 172
Location: Joensuu
kitester wrote:
They also have a smooth skin on the bottom which eliminates drag.

yes, but it's effect is very little, oher things are much more important

kitester wrote:
The closer to the edge the WW a kite flies the more susceptible it can be to gusts and direction changes in the wind.

no.
kitester wrote:
Modern inflatable kites just change position as the wind changes velocity or direction. But for a ram air kite a sudden changes in velocity or direction have a much greater effect. Ram air kites need the constant pressure of wind (actual or apparent) to keep them inflated. If a ram air kite is caught up wind of the wind window it loses this pressure and begins to deflate. When this happens the wing can become deformed and stop flying. The more it deforms the further down wind it will drift until it either re-inflates or ends up as crumpled fabric dead down wind.

it takes at least 5 minutes for closed cell kite to deflate so much that it starts deforming. in 5 minutes whitout any wind every kite will be in land/water


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