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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:46 am 
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Posts: 6
airtime last only a year. period. The valves peals off and the glue looks like gel after the year. I guess humidity in air (over 90% here) causes the problem, but certainly the product is not designed to really last longer, as they claim, at least in the tropic. I tried to glue them back but after a short time they started to leak air again and then to peal off. Also the big bladder pealed itself off in a section. So it's a waste of time and money. I'm certainly so pissed off of this issue that i'm mentalized to move to a foil, so i don't have to deal with this "#$% bladders again. I think LEI are so depreciated (price) in the second hand market due this design failure of the bladders, and also buying a new cheap kite of the last years is the same, because in my experience using the kite or not the glue becomes gel or something that is not glue anymore (on any brand). this is the way those chemical work, to drain your pocket again. :x


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Mon Aug 15, 2011 3:09 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2003 7:06 pm
Posts: 2317
Location: MD
isaldarriaga wrote:
airtime last only a year. period. The valves peals off and the glue looks like gel after the year. I guess humidity in air (over 90% here) causes the problem, but certainly the product is not designed to really last longer, as they claim, at least in the tropic. I tried to glue them back but after a short time they started to leak air again and then to peal off. Also the big bladder pealed itself off in a section. So it's a waste of time and money. I'm certainly so pissed off of this issue that i'm mentalized to move to a foil, so i don't have to deal with this "#$% bladders again. I think LEI are so depreciated (price) in the second hand market due this design failure of the bladders, and also buying a new cheap kite of the last years is the same, because in my experience using the kite or not the glue becomes gel or something that is not glue anymore (on any brand). this is the way those chemical work, to drain your pocket again. :x

What are you talking about? Are you complaining about bladders in general being unreliable?

This thread is about the Orange bladder product which is a new material Airtime released a couple years ago. Just folks discussing bad experiences with that product.

Nobody (other than you, maybe) is saying that the Airtime product or bladders in general are unreliable. I've been on a lot of different kites and have never experienced the problems you describe above. At least not as a regular occurance...once in a while there is a leak to repair or a company buys a bad run of bladders which is always covered under a warranty. The Airtime spare bladders and repair kits also have always been top quality products in my experience. Pricey, but they work well.

I hope your LEI luck improves, it sounds like you have had a bad run of kites!


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Wed Sep 14, 2011 12:53 am 
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+1 vote to avoid orange bladders, they stretch a bit, don't stretch back and fail early. I replaced two leading edge bladders in my older naish kites, making them not One-Pump, to once and for all fix the softening leading edges. One bladder got little leaks where I tied the line to pull it through the leading edge, the other just gave way at the tip as I was walking the kite upwind a bit, I thought I must have walked it into a thistle or a cactus or something. Funny thing was just thinking this kite is holding air really well, then it just went ffffffft, and slumped to the ground. This failure appeared to be where the bladder end was folded back onto itself, you can see the material stretched out ait, got thin then a 1/4 inch hole opened up. So one bladder never worked for me in the first place, and the other worked for one day.
I am generally a real competent fixer of things, so bummed I bought 2 of these before knowing to buy polyurethane bladders. I would call and complain but I really do not want any more of this company's products after they touted these so much. I'm somewhat surprised they aren't selling good stretchy PU bladders like the original mfgs bladders by now.


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 10:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 5:50 pm
Posts: 388
Location: Too far away from the water, again.
Ah feck. Just got one of these as a replacement LE (with all the valves)... should have checked the interwebs first. Anyone know if these have improved, or should I stand by for some kite-related frustration and disappointment?


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 3:32 pm 
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Posts: 123
Location: Jupiter, FL
Gave up on these over a year ago. Maybe had some residual sand inside the bladder pocket and got a number of small pinholes in them. Good news is I've heard you can fix them with packing tape.

No thanks.

Got a guy a couple hours north of me that did full sets of custom bladders for my 07 12M rebel and 9M LF session for like $350 or so. I had been replacing failed bladders every few sessions with the airtime stuff. Nice thick thermoplastic polyurethane bladders and I could not be happier. He's probably got thousands of OEM bladders for other brands, but his custom stuff is great.

www.kitebladder.com

Chris


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2012 4:17 pm 
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Location: Too far away from the water, again.
Well, I've got it now, so I may as well use it. I mean, they can't be that bad, to have stayed in business this long.

No doubt I will be posting soon to confirm that orange bladders are actually great. :-?


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:30 pm 
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Dear all,

We came across this topic due too a tip of one of our customers.
We are the distributor of U-Stick for the most part of Europe and service thousands of customers each year with one of our Orange bladders or stick-on valves.
We support many kitebrands with their warranty issues and work very closely with many kiterepair stations in Europe.

Introducing a new material will always set off bells and make people ask questions and we are happy to answer to all comments both positive and negative to learn from eachother to keep developing better products.

Since we introduced Orange bladders we saw a massive drop in warranty claims due too the fact most kitebladders get damaged due too blow-outs when strut sleeves pop open for instance.
With thousands of bladders being sold each year and many more valves there will never be a time warranty issues will drop to zero as where people work both in production and installation mistakes can be made.

However if someone ever experiences problems with our orange bladders we'd love them to contact us to see if we can help out in any way. We will always find a solution which keeps us both happy!

To answer to the questions we could get out of this thread:

- If there is a leak in an Orange kitebladder please use Tear-Aid Type A to do a repair. We sell it as branded item in our shop though you can get it from pretty much any outdoor shop around. It sticks very well as long as you make sure to clean (and even better lightly sand) the surface with alcohol. When using this you won't need any additional glue.

- The orange material when outside the bladder is a bit more fragile to sharp object then a regular kitebladder. Keep notice when installing the bladder to not have any sharp objects around. When the bladder is installed the Orange bladder is a lot stronger and lighter then the original bladder. Therefore we still decided to choose Orange as our preffered material.

- Make sure to use Orange stick-on valves when using an Orange bladder. The adhesive used on an Orange stick-on valve is different then the adhesive we use on our Fix Kit valves (for the repair of OEM bladders). A Fix Kit valve will in heat or due time not hold very well on an orange bladder. You can see the difference between Fix Kit and Orange by reading the packaging or checking the shape of the sticker. (Octagon shape: Orange. Round shape: Fix Kit)

If you feel your bladder isn't holding out as expected please contact us via our contact form http://www.u-stick.eu/contactsor by private message including a picture of what seems to be the problem so we can help out.

@Mr Weetabix: Please contact us if you have any questions and note our kite bladder repair manual http://www.u-stick.eu/leading-edge-replacement for a step by step outline on how to do a repair.

Best regards
Dominique Kwaks
U-Stick Europe


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 4:56 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2004 6:39 pm
Posts: 586
Location: Iowa
Hi, I've been keeping up with this thread with interest. I also have a kite with orange bladders. I've had leaks in three struts over the year that I have owned the kite. One strut has been fixed in 3 different places and it still leaks (I keep finding new leaks). Been using TearAid and it works when applied. Like others, a new leak appears, seemingly, during installation. I install bladders on good grass with no sharp objects around. Also, I've made many fixes to the old PU bladders with consistent success. Other kites that I have owned over the years don't develop random leaks in the bladder material (pumped my 2007 after a year without being pumped and spent the whole day on it without any problem). I've fixed leaks around valves and leaks when I did something dumb. Never had a random leak in bladder material like the orange ones seem to develop. I am also planning to replace my bladders with the clear PU. Nothing more maddening than leaks that develop for, seemingly, no reason.

Good to hear that your warranty claims have been reduce with the introduction of orange bladders, but seems like there is still a problem. But, I hear consistent complains on this forum more than one individual. Maybe the material is too thin on some bladders and Quality does not catch it. Seems like you have an issue to investigate.


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 5:20 pm 
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Dear gbgreen59

Does your kite only has orange bladders in it? This is a very rare thing already as no one would replace all bladders just for fun. It makes us wonder if there might be sharp stitching or other object on the inside of your bladder sleeves.
Why would all the bladders have been replaced in the first place? We very rarely hear of kites which need to have all the bladders replaced. If we do this usually happens when there have been production errors in the canopy which tend to damage the bladder.

We're just trying to think with you. If you like you can send us pictures to ustick@u-stick.nl.

As for problems with the material, as soon as a problem gets reported Airtime Kite (who are the developers of U-Stick) checks it out and pretty much always find what caused the problem!

Best regards
Dominique Kwaks
http://www.u-stick.eu


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 Post subject: Re: Orange Bladders
PostPosted: Wed Aug 01, 2012 1:03 am 
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I have a very simple question for the Airtime rep: is there a commercially available glue that works on orange blodder? I currently have a kite that I would like to use tomorrow that has the octagonal dump valve leaking. I tried to remove it via hot water and that got the material around the valve to become totally toast (evidently the melting point of it is about equal to 220F). With any other blodder it would be no big deal - remove old valve, re-glue it with AquaSeal and I'd be kiting the next day. With orange blodder it seams that I am stuck - I need to get the stick-on valve from Airtime and that will take a long time and then I got to somehow fix the area around the valve which is impossible to do without good cement. How do you remove these valves anyways if hot water does destroy the blodder material? Is it basically a throw-away product - once one valve delaminates, you have to throw it away because there no way to remove it without destroying the blodder?


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