Could you please point out ANY post of mine which says we do not teach our students how to bodydrag upwind ? To make this chore worth your while, I'll pay you $50 for each post you find.thesimianprince wrote:Interesting leash discussion, and valid arguments on both sides.
I learnt in 2004 on the South coast of England.
The school used reel leashes (no option given and no info about how they could be dangerous). Helmets also used.
The reel leash definitely saved time in the learning process, and I wanted to use it.
Yes I continued using a leash (probably cause that's the way I was taught) but didn't buy a helmet of my own
Yes, it was because I wasn't confident to body-drag back to my board, and didn't want to lose time/energy trying to get it back (wanted riding time, not dragging time..), and wasn't really taught these skills. Yes, by this time I knew there was risk but didn't want to give up the leash.
Yes, the board finally twatted me on the head in 2006 or so, on day 2 of a week's kiting holiday in Hurghada/Egypt (5 stitches, but carried on kiting wearing a rather fetching purple swimming cap)
Yes, I bought a helmet after that, and continued using the reel leash
In 2007 or so went on a kite trip to Portugal and the guy running it couldn't believe I was using a board leash, and told me in no uncertain times to stop immediately, and gave me some key upwind body-dragging tips. At this time I would say I was a reasonably competent kiter, easily keep upwind, wave riding etc, just always used a leash. I ended up using one of his boards due to light winds, had a crash, and was forced to body drag to find it (it had no place for me to attach my leash) and from that day I never used the leash again, I felt totally liberated. Kind of like finally ditching the training wheels on a bike - not that I remember that far back
Having been through the leash mill I would say this: the leash has no place in lessons, whatever the circumstances! (sorry Richard, you should teach people how to drag upwind - it will take longer but ultimately students will thank you for it - it's a critical skill and definitely is not wasted time! Once you know how it's really not so difficult/taxing, I was just never shown how to do it properly! I wish I had been taught these skills at the beginning.
Yes, I wear a helmet whenever I kite. Which is not so often now, living 700kms from the coast
Happy kiting and RIP Rene.
First, you should be commended for your perseverance and willingness to spend a large sum on lessons (unless the boat lessons of which you complain were very cheap). Also for purchasing equipment so that you could put in the time to PRACTICE and develop “...relatively good kite skills. ”Kite Kasia wrote:.......! That was how I very quickly clocked up 16h still having no idea how to kitesurf! I still remember my bodydragging session - off you go, yep you got it! Did I?!?!
I decided to try again back home with a local instructor in 1:1 lessons and got hooked... I got my first kite and started to go out with already kitesurfing friends keeping an eye on me, I was out only in light to moderate cross onshore winds and on wide sandy and shallow(-ish) beaches where you can walk in the water to get your board back (but often had to fight with what looked back then as a massive white wash ). It never EVER even once occurred to me to attach a leash to my board! And let me tell you I was constantly loosing it... twice I thought it was gone for good. It was so frustrating!
I learnt to efficiently bodydrag upwind to recover my board in one tack only in my first cold water winter session, I got it in less than 10min It was that or go home (or get hypothermia!)
What I am trying to say is that there is absolutely NO NEED for kiteboard leashes, but the blame for using them lies on both sides - instructors and students. If there was an international and compulsory requirement of NOT USING a kiteboard leash during any type of instruction, frustrated (and sometimes lazy) students wouldn't have an option of ditching schools not using leashes for instructors who will happily provide them. If somebody (student) thinks kitesurfing is that easy, it's obviously not a right sport for them and they could be already flagged as a potential risk and danger to themselves and others.
I believe a good instructor with a right approach can teach anyone to bodydrag to quickly recover a board in about 15-30min. But of course that is providing that the student was firstly properly tough how to handle a kite and already has relatively good kite skills.
The offers of "we will get you up on the board in first lesson" are simply shocking! Unless the first lesson is like a 2-3 day long It's worth to put an effort and time to make your students understand how important is every step of learning process and if they skip anything they won't be able to progress.
Hi Richard,RichardM wrote: First, you should be commended for your perseverance and willingness to spend a large sum on lessons (unless the boat lessons of which you complain were very cheap). Also for purchasing equipment so that you could put in the time to PRACTICE and develop “...relatively good kite skills. ”
However, it’s too bad you’re in Ireland because if you were anywhere near LA, I’d pay you $500 to teach me how to consistently “...efficiently bodydrag upwind to recover my board in one tack after a TYPICAL wipeout where it ends up AT LEAST 15 feet behind. I also won’t mind if I can’t learn this in “.... less than 10min ". Even people much more proficient than me are usually seen making more than ONE tack to recover a board that may have started out only being 5 feet behind them.
Also, since you “...believe a good instructor with a right approach can teach anyone to bodydrag to quickly recover a board in about 15-30min.” , I’d appreciate it if you’d explain which parts of our typical bodydragging lesson described below are unnecessary.
Additionally, it’s ALSO important to know HOW MUCH TIME AND MONEY I should expect my students to have spent PRIOR to this body dragging lesson since the results you claim are possible is conditional upon the student ALREADY having “...relatively good kite skills.” Please include ALL prior lesson and equipment costs and ALL prior lesson and (I assume) practice time.
Old people do not try new things. They do the things they already know. I know it looks good in a mountain dew commercial to see granny snowboard down the mountain . . . but . . . if old folks are not even willing to put the 3 days in to switch from skis over to a snowboard what are the odds they will put in the month for kiteboarding. Maybe 1 in a 100. Not happening. There is no stampede of olds.tomatkins wrote: HERE COME THE BOOMERS
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