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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:21 pm 
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Tautologies you are alone here who wants to slow down the development of the raceboards and make hundreds in china in the same mold.
Do you want the kite raceboard become the same as RS:X?

Are you concerned that a local shaper can build a better board than North or Aguera within the same weight limit and dimensions?
There would be no problem in windsurfing equipment price if there would be a minimum weight and dimension rules.

I do not agree that most custom boards will be more expensive than IKA registered boards. There would be a supply of lower priced boards also which could be competitive and maybe available in spring.

The major difference between box rule and IKA registered desing is the sticker worth 400Eur so why not to sell it separately?
You can register any desing within box rules so why a board within box rules is banned from the competitions?
Major companies do not manage to supply boards on time anyway the same as custom builders.
So why there is an obligation for 30 boards to produce anyway?
I suggest to make it 10 boards for national competitions, 20 boards rule for worlwide competitions and 100 boards for Olympics.
Existing rules will not stop very different level equipment to be ridden in Olypics if they will be the same.

Custom board builders are a pain in the ass for the big guys because they are developing new desings and pushing it forward all the time and are able to adapt.
Big guys want to slow everythink down because they do not want to change their cooking technology and teach the labor again. The income is their goal.

When do you think the fins will become a registered design? Or there is no point because it can not be produced locally?

I agree with you Newind and support your ideas.
Let the kiteboard building be a passion and not only the bussines.


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:50 pm 
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Hollow: what do you think aguera is? Some big enterprise? He is no different from OP.

I think you misunderstand my point. It is not because of the price of one board from a custom shaped it is that you would need to get a new board for every competition because the development moves fast.

Do you guys really think raceing is lucrative for any brand? I fount there is much money in it for now...the value lies in the future. Brands are competing for market shares and positions in the future...


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 12:54 pm 
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Btw op..your boards looks really nice :)


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Wed May 30, 2012 2:39 pm 
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I suppose Aguera sold 10 times more boards than OP last year.
Box rules will normaly slow down the development.
Last few years were pretty intensive in terms of development but it will slow down and you would not have to buy new board each seasson.
Twintip business is more lucrative for sure.
you right brands are competing for market shares and positions in the future... and cutting off small competitors in advance.


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:05 am 
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Hollow wrote:
I suppose Aguera sold 10 times more boards than OP last year.
Box rules will normaly slow down the development.
Last few years were pretty intensive in terms of development but it will slow down and you would not have to buy new board each seasson.
Twintip business is more lucrative for sure.
you right brands are competing for market shares and positions in the future... and cutting off small competitors in advance.


You suppose he sold 10 times more boards..so OP sold about 3 boards? ..but it is all an assumption?
How do you know bigger brands are building hundreds of boards in a mold in China? How big to you think kiteracing is?

I'm not saying I don't see any weaknesses to the model, but so far I think it is a better model for riders like "average Joe" because it gives us an opportunity to compete with the same gear as the pro's. It definitely is pulling the rug from under a small board shaper UNLESS he believes enough in his product to produce 30 boards.

The whole point of the rule is to secure that it is skills that make the difference in a competition and not how many boards you can buy that decides your competitiveness. I think you guys are forgetting that. Making weird claims about the hundreds of board being produced by the evil international super conglomerates companies just make this whole discussion seem weird. I am not even sure if the biggest producer of raceboards reach 100 boards in a year.


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 12:34 pm 
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Location: italy
I want to understand
I'm adapting to the rule of the 30 board
but I fear that soon the rules change
and I hope it will not be back at the expense of small businesses.
IKA has first to support athletes
but at the same time can not embarrass anyone
We are all here for a passion and no one should suffer


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 12:38 pm 
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Aguera CR64 and CR69 are made in Vietnam so its not a small bacth of 20 boards or so.
When Aguera and Mike started shaping their boards there were no production rules of 30 boards and
they were able to build few boards and run it in various competitions growing year by year.
Now the doors are closed to start shaping on yourself from zero and risk so high with 30 boards in stock.

Where is the difference between 30 boards rule and 10 if you can't order MikesLAB raceboard in 3 months anyway.
The supply is limited.

Why not to let building the custom raceboards <190*70cm, >6kg, <1000Eur to be available for the competitions?
Each type would be specified and available for the other competitors.

Will it distort the class?


I do not agree that a majority would love to ride one type board and fins.
Each rider uses his personal strategy and various equipment that suits him/her best.
I prefer to increase the list of available equipment.


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:08 pm 
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Hollow wrote:
Why not to let building the custom raceboards <190*70cm, >6kg, <1000Eur to be available for the competitions?

That's it.
We should be able to compete on any board within box rules which are:
- Max length 190cm
- Max width 70cm
- Minimum weight 6,0kg
- Max price of a hull 1000€
- Max two set of fins

This is presently the best option for next 2-3 years as board's manufactures ignored customers in 2012. Racing cannot afford the same rubbish scenario next years.
I do not believe anymore in North, RRD and Cabrinha promises.
There are about a hundred people in Poland waiting for supply of 2012 boards.
There are only 3 boards of 2012 during first two events of Polish cup in May. It sucks!
How other riders on Cabrinha 59cm 2011 (designed in 2009) with 27cm long fins can compete in winds 5-7knots on? Sorry to say but it's a joke.

Let’s push IKA to postpone the board's registration scheme for next 2 years. It would allow small manufactures to start up and prepare for the real production scheme in 2015.

We have the excellent box rules. Let's stay within in it on any board.
Otherwise we would seriously slow down the sport next year and the competitions would reserved only for team riders.

One more thing. We have a number of small manufactures in Europe who got know-how and are keen to develop the racing boards. Huge advantage of them is a fact that they might deliver a board in 2-3 weeks from on order and repair it in a week. What is availability of Chine made boards I do not need to write. Guarantee claims? It exists ofcourse but you need to wait up to 3-4 months to get a new board from China. How many North and RRD boards from first delivery were sinking Titanics? 100%? Does anybody ride these first boards who are less than 10kg in weight now?

Please note that we won the Games because we were flexible, quick adapting to the changes and first of all – we listened to the riders but not only manufactures. Let’s do not make same mistake as windsurfers done (read only one big manufacture kingdom).


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:20 pm 
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Twintip business is more lucrative for sure."

"Lucrative" lol lol!

The problem in "sanctioned" events where someone thinks they have control over you (can you even compete? (your countries ISAF/IKA accredited governing kiteboard racing body decides - may even be a group of sailors (non kiters) and not just by race results alone ... / and on what (did you pay that 400 euros/min quantity)). This is the control mechanism that IKA/ISAF are relying on. When push comes to shove maybe no one will give a crap or even bother turning up from overseas to Perth event.


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 Post subject: Re: is equal for all?
PostPosted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:44 pm 
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Posts: 227
Location: Australia
longwhitecloud wrote:
from overseas to Perth event.


Is there an event in perth :o


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