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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 4:27 am 
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Hey Sandbag, thx for reply in detail. It makes it more worth giving feedback. :-) :thumb:

My personal opinion is that a 14 is GREAT in the 12 knots. I hate with a passion being underpowered. I think a 14 and 10 overlaps nicely at least with the kites I have ridden.

When that is said, I agree great sessions for waves usually comes with the smaller kites. In 30 a 6 is a clear winner for me. Never really ridden a 5...but next size down from that would be a plastic bag I assume. I doubt I would be able to ride a 5 in 30 knots...but who knows maybe it would be perfect.

I also love the 9, but the gap between a 14 and 9 is a little much. Though I also think the gap between 9 and 6 is on the high side, I do think it also have to do with how many times you get to use the size. If the 6 is only out 4-5 times a year, but a 7 would get you out maybe 10-12, but you'd be a bit over powered on 1or 2 of the 6 sessions I think it is worth doing a 14 - 10 - 9 - 7 ..but I am speaking from my experience with the parks and over on Oahu, where the 10 is great in the waves and much better than an 11..but the 9 is perfect...


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:07 am 
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I would go A. Those 5 meter kites are not used too much (depending on where u live) but they are nice and small to pack away and those days you do get to use them the beaches are often nice and quiet leaving you to have more fun to yourself! - thats my view, I have 3 kites 5,7,9. weigh 80 kilos


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 9:36 am 
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Hmmm, actually small kites are generally used more and more it seems.

Here in Denmark, or at spots like Capetown and similar, a 5m2 is sometimes too big for the average rider weight in waves, on very good days.

So some has gotten 4m2, and even 3.5m2 now :naughty:

The problem with most of these kites though, IMO - is the designers make them too cambered and similar to the bigger ones (7-8m2) :(

Perfect if used by lighter riders or children, in lower winds, yes.

But when the wind speed is up - you need WAY more depower when going Down The Line with the wind, if you have the kite low - and you want to SURF freely on the wave and not be dictated by what the kite can handle :naughty:
Even if you are powered fine or even a bit low when going halfwind with the smallest kites - it does not work well when you go with the wind sweeping the kite across :(
Whereas a normal bigger kitesize like a 7, will be no problem at all even if really powered, because of the lower windspeed :thumb:

IMO a design flaw EVERY brand makes these days :-?

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 10:16 am 
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@admj2281: 8 as the smallest kite would be out of the question here - that would wreck most of the great sessions ! But I agree on keeping them close (or closer than I used to) - that is my main aim now .. I guess.

@tautologies: I agree on the usability of the 14 -- I loved using it - but as you 9-to-14 is to much and 7-10 as well. Here in Denmark, lots of people have 7 as their smallest, but apparently they must like to be overpowered --- Can't live with that as the smallest :-(

@average rider: that is a windy place you live :-) But I look forward to those sizes!

@Peter Frank: I agree with the scaling of the kites. When you ride with the smallest kites, the waves has so much punch, that you really just want the kite hanging there. But I must admit - I still fly the kite alot in the small sizes as well :-)


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 1:48 pm 
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Wooops, maybe I did not explain exactly what I meant then....

When high wind - one can of course park the kite easy, or just fly it back and fourth up high going down the line :thumb:

But the more difficult part is to fly the kite very low, maybe backstalled slightly occasionally to put it exactly where you want it, so it is just a natural extension of you, and you do it on the backbone without thinking, and it does not hinder ANY moves you do - but will still give you way more options IMO.

In order to be able to do this, you need a kite that can be depowered HUGELY, as the windspeed itself is the problem, when you fly the kite low across the window :o

As you say Sandbag - it is even worse in big waves where you scream down the waveface in your bottomturn, true.

But my point was - that the windspeed itself will make the demand that small kites (3 to 5m2) used in this wind, has more depower (less camber) than their bigger brothers (7-8-9m2), eventhough they are "pleasantly" powered, and equally powered, going halfwind or for freestyle :naughty:

Simple physics that one can feel immediately out there in waves, when you are out often with and in 4 to 5m2 kites/wind 8)

The thing that happens with most kites is, that it will pull hard when deep in the window so you get a slightly bigger radius, or a lot bigger - so your path on the wave is sometimes dictated by the kite :cry:
Instead of (with a more depowerable kite) a free flowing carve where you can do it either tight up the face, or fast in a drawn out curve down past a section - FREELY like you wish :naughty:

This is not a problem with big kites 7-8-9m2 :wink:
And in these sizes and bigger, parking the kite is actually more difficult or not possible if the wind is'nt sligthly side-off.
Where it is the other way around with the small kites - easy to park or almost park, and difficult to fly it low if you go aggressively vertical on the waveface.

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 5:42 pm 
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Peter_Frank wrote:
Wooops

This is not a problem with big kites 7-8-9m2 :wink:

:D Peter


And where i kitesurf not a problem either with actual BIG kites 17-18-19m2 :wink:

..................................... :surf: :sun: .......................................................................................................


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2012 6:34 pm 
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Sandbag wrote:
...I have come up with the following alternatives:

A: 5, 7, 9, 12
B: 5, 7, 10, 14
C: 6, 8, 10, 14
D ?? you suggest :-)
...

Ahhh, a 4 kite quiver. That would be sweet. I'm always trying to make compromises with 3 kites and then you always hear about smaller guys getting by with 2 (or else bigger guys who just refuse to ride light wind).

Choose C! or B.

If you are going with 4 kites, don't short change yourself on the light wind end...you want that 14. A 6M should take you to some pretty scary big winds. I also think that you are correct to group your smaller sizes closer together as the larger kites tend to have a wider wind range....despite what the kite company wind charts say.

Also some brands are bigger than others. My SS deltas tend to run small, so I actually found the 6M to be too small for me and jumped to a 7 instead. However, I have friends who fly F1 and those kites tend to run big. I don't know the Naish sizing, you'll figure it out...

Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: choosing the sizes in a four kite quiver
PostPosted: Sat Aug 11, 2012 1:11 pm 
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CaptainArgh wrote:


.... don't short change yourself on the light wind end...you want that 14. .....

Good luck!


Yeah! you got a point there! It's a bitch :-(


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