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Cabrinha IDS malfunction

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bnthere
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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby bnthere » Fri Sep 21, 2012 7:14 pm

tmcfarla wrote:If self-landing is the only time this is an issue, the easiest solution is landing from a tether.

For me: landing with an assistant is always best, self-landing with a tether is just as good, landing in the water by releasing bar and winding the lines is only for an emergency. The only time I'll self-land on the beach without a tether is if I'm doing a down-winder.



disabling the kite onto the leash system is not only for "emergencies." it is effective and easy and should be something everyone is 100% comfortable with. for many purposes including self landing.

there are 3 variations of leash line / disable systems for inflatable kites: single centerline (which includes 5th line), single outside line, and double centerline. single centerline systems are effective on every inflatable kite, single outside lines work better on some kites than others and generally make a line mess on most, and double centerlines (imo) are debatably effective (i have seen them work well on some canopy shapes / bridle configurations, and very poorly on others). its not rocket science.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby ronnie » Sat Sep 22, 2012 8:25 am

If you drop the kite from near overhead, it will usually end up in the U position.
If you drop it from about 45 degress, it usually lands U position then flips over into the parked position as it blows downwind and stays like that.

If I have to drop the kite because the wind has got too strong and it ends up in the U position, it has lifted up and down into the sky, and there is more pull when it is high in the sky. There was enough pull to make it difficult to wind on the lines. It could be that there would be some people would need to turn the bar end over end to wind the lines on.

I will have to check if I can keep it on the ground and stop it lifting into the air. My idea is, that if I get to the bar, and bring the bar back down the IDS line just enough to put very slight tension on the rear lines, if I can tie the IDS line to the bar in that position, the kite will stay on the ground. This is only when the kite is lifting up and down. In lighter wind its weight keeps it on the ground.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby fishy » Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:36 am

I agree that this doesn't sound like a malfunction, it's just what the kite can do when you transfer the load onto the IDS, it either sits in the 'horse shoe' position or as somebody else said rolls over onto it's leading edge.

I think one important point to remember is take a step or two towards the kite, or if you're in the water swim towards it; and this allows it to to dump the power fully. I must admit I've never had the kite overhead whilst on the IDS, but I have had them hover about 15' or so off the water whilst winding the lines onto the bar, which is normal, either way it's not going to have much power in it, if you're still concerned, contact Cabrinha, they take a while to get back to you, but they will answer questions like this, would be interesting to find out why it sits overhead??

You definitely shouldn't have twists in your lines though, as already mentioned you can manually untwist with the 2012 version, and the 2011 versions have a swivel. I get a few twists between the bar and the swivel, but nothing from the swivel to the kite.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby ronnie » Sat Sep 22, 2012 9:55 am

fishy wrote:I agree that this doesn't sound like a malfunction, it's just what the kite can do when you transfer the load onto the IDS, it either sits in the 'horse shoe' position or as somebody else said rolls over onto it's leading edge.

I think one important point to remember is take a step or two towards the kite, or if you're in the water swim towards it; and this allows it to to dump the power fully. I must admit I've never had the kite overhead whilst on the IDS, but I have had them hover about 15' or so off the water whilst winding the lines onto the bar, which is normal, either way it's not going to have much power in it, if you're still concerned, contact Cabrinha, they take a while to get back to you, but they will answer questions like this, would be interesting to find out why it sits overhead??

You definitely shouldn't have twists in your lines though, as already mentioned you can manually untwist with the 2012 version, and the 2011 versions have a swivel. I get a few twists between the bar and the swivel, but nothing from the swivel to the kite.


You can see at 30 seconds into this video that if you get the chance, you can pull in the IDS line just before the kite hits the water and release it just when it hits the water. Could save you having to swim toward the kite.
The more C-shaped kites seem to be the ones more likely to get stuck leading edge down.


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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby jteabird » Sun Sep 23, 2012 5:12 pm

If you have any more than 5 twist in your lines your IDS most likely will not function correctly And your kite will still pull like a truck. The center line will wrap around the IDS line and will not let it slide and deploy. The swivel is worthless and it's common knowledge that it does not actually work. Many times if you are lucky enough and your IDS does deploy you are at risk for your kite flipping upside and relaunching in the smile position (inverted) pulling you or landing in a tree. Cabrinha should offer free upgrades on all 2009-2012 kites where you can Not untwist the center line from wrapping around the IDS line. This is why north has a 5th line so the center lines cand wrap around the safety line.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby IWB2 » Sun Sep 23, 2012 8:49 pm

jteabird wrote: The swivel is worthless and it's common knowledge that it does not actually work. .


Jtbird,
I think you mentioned you are riding a 2012 model. If this is the case you can at any point untwist your centerlines with ease by simply turning the QR1. The system could not be any easier to use. There is no excuse for not being unable to untwist your center lines.

What model kite are you using?

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby jteabird » Mon Sep 24, 2012 2:47 am

I have 4 (8,10,12 and 14 ) 2011 cabrinha switchblade kites. I love the kite, but think the IDS is dangerous and misleading. The swivel does not work so the centerline wraps around the IDS line and does not allow the load to transfer to the IDS line. Warning if you like to do tricks one way and have a few twist in your lines your IDS will not work. You may have to ditch the kite completely. Warning if you activate your IDS your kite may invert and take off flying overhead and pulling you into shore and land in a tree or pull you on the shore. I love cabrinha kites but would respect cabrinha more if they offered Me a free upgrade to a IDS that actually works. Like I said before this is why north has a seperate 5th line safety line.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby KiteboardingTampaBay » Mon Sep 24, 2012 4:36 am

The IDS has always been a piece of shit. The kites I have now use a similar mini-5th system, and yep you guessed it, it's a piece of shit! They can bind up, or worse, 1/2 depower the kite and start death looping.
I taught on Cabs for several years, and with self rescue being a big part of my lesson plan (daily deployment) it never worked. I rode the 2013 Switchblade, and the newer system is more complicated and still garbage. 75% of the owners don't know how to rig them correctly anyway. :thumb:
The problems jteabird mentioned with line binding are real, and technically can happen on any kite. I still think a single front line is the safest, followed by a REAL 5th line.

www.kiteboardingtampabay.com

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby pmaggie » Mon Sep 24, 2012 10:55 am

@IWB2: not in any case, but if you're activating your QR maybe you don't have the time (or the conditions) to turn the QR1 until the lines are untwisted. In my opinion, a safety device should work quite immediately since you're in total emergency.

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Re: Cabrinha IDS malfunction

Postby IWB2 » Mon Sep 24, 2012 12:26 pm

pmaggie wrote:@IWB2: not in any case, but if you're activating your QR maybe you don't have the time (or the conditions) to turn the QR1 until the lines are untwisted. In my opinion, a safety device should work quite immediately since you're in total emergency.

Pmaggie, If you are flying the 2012 and newer IDS system you have the ability to untwist your center lines at any point. In this event you should have at most cases 2 - 3 twists at any point in time, even if you are thowing spin after spin, becuase you can with ease (taking about 1 second) just twist your QR1 and presto the center lines untwist. See link around 2.03 for section on unspinning center lines. .

Pmaggie, because a rider now has the ability to instantly untwist their centerlines, a rider should never have any excuse for having tons of twists, and therefore should never have any problems with the IDS system not working at any point in time, so your point about the rider not having time to untwist the centerlines in an emergency is not an issue, because the rider should only have a minimal amount of twists.


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