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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:20 am 
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Speaking about battens (a bit off topic, but not fully...), can anyone remember what the name of the kite or kitebrand that made kites with battens only was ?

I have flown that kite myself - I think it was German, but not sure ?

Many years ago, maybe 2001-2004 ?

A four line C kite with fibre battens instead of struts, all over.

Very fast to inflate and pack down, I remember :naughty:

But battens are heavy and will work through the canopy, so thats why most or all brands have stopped using them, also at the tips only :wink:

Also - in the case of a self rescue it would be nice to have air in the struts when the LE is deflated 8)
Although, I have never used this myself...


Sorry for not being precise on-topic-headline, but someone asked about it in this thread - can anyone remember that kite ?

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 11:35 am 
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Windtech Rebel…


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 12:35 pm 
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james wrote:
Windtech Rebel…


Aaah - I found it while searching for above (which I believe dont have battens only ? Or did it ?).

It was the Windtools Booster :thumb:

http://www.oase.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000529.html

Can remember now, that one could adjust the camber by tightening or loosening the 5/7 carbon battens :naughty:

Never got popular but somewhat a good idea :wink:

:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:50 pm 
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Peter... Are you saying the battens would rip out of the trailing edge? I could see how a kite would have way more wear to it than a hang glider.

Boardriding... I haven't ridden the Rides much, just watching others, you can see how the center of the kite has a hard time catching the wind when face down. You have to wait for the kite to drift downwind, catch the wind and then launch. The Park or Bolt will catch the wind sooner, therefore launching faster.

Do you think the reason you like your kites is because of the strutless design or is it just the shape? Would be interesting to try the same shape with one, two struts. You could just Velcro a strut on there and see how it goes.


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 4:54 pm 
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maui, keep the stoke!

great thread and super awesome to see people building refined gear for themselves.


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2012 8:49 pm 
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Location: drtuba.eu, kite-stuff.org, eXtremist.si, kajtar.si
Hi,

just saw your post and your kite looks really cool. The sweetest thing in the hobby kite designing is the thing that your kite designs can actually work! Keep up the good work! All I would probably change on your design is the shape of wingtips (see the end of my video). It will help in relaunch. Straight (L shaped) tips are usually known to catch the water too often/soon when relaunching in combination with opened arc of the kite needing a knot or two more wind than usually.

I agree that kite don't need struts when flying. But it needs at least 1 to be generally good at relaunching (altho if you read the post in my thread the thing about raising wingtip and then air catching in the middle...?). One of the good advantages of struts it that they don't allow too much stress on the canopy, preventing damages. Recently I'm not going under 3 struts with my designs.

@aircatcher - If you read my post near the video it was meant as a teaser. The kite you saw in the video was just a regular kite with not tuned profile, AoA, TE. The strutless from this thread has different profile, AoA (tips are noticeable) and TE continuous from tip to tip (probably concave but not so clear from the video). Arc of the kite is roughly the same. Also the wind conditions we had that day was bad and if you looks closer we were w/o harnesses. But even this kite shows profile breakings in sharp turns (see 1:53) and will flutter when doing kloops/driving hard downwind as we did on purpose or making unusual turns.

boardriding maui wrote:
My apologies to some posters that I had to log off before I could respond to and thank everyone. And thanks for the stoke since.

Thanks for posting the link to previous discussion. I had seen the video, but not the dialogue, which is probably a good thing. Yesterday was my first post ever, and I surely would not have done so had I read all the comments from people speaking in such absolutes. Madness. My version of that would go, "I saw a 3 strut kite _____ once, so clearly all 3 strut kites do the same." Fill in the blank with whatever you like.

I'm sure we all agree that every design is unique. On my side, I'll be sure not to feature "strutless" in the future because, while interesting, that in itself was never the goal. The goal is light, fast, fun, range - whatever it is that myself, my family and friends want to ride.


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:36 am 
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Thanks for your comments offering help Gigi. Let me know if you're on Maui any time and I'll be happy to meet up for a ride. I'm guessing the kite may be interesting to you, and perhaps influence some of the ideas you've offered. As for "hobby kite designing", I guess you could call it this as my work is my passion, so still a hobby of sorts? I've been in the industry for a while.


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 9:54 am 
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I've been playing a lot with no strut design (gigi should remember ;) )...very good in low wind, lots of pleasure to play with, but absolutely not good in high winds, and relaunch isn't enough good to sell that for water (my point of view).

but...I hope you could find a way to enhance this feature, probably not impossible ! good luck :)


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 10:25 am 
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I've seen the kite in high winds..or at least what I would call high winds (I'd say gusting to 40 mph)...it seemed to work well.

:thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Strutless kite in development on Maui
PostPosted: Tue Oct 02, 2012 11:02 am 
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Btw, a very interesting board in the picture. What is it?


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