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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 12:50 am 
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yes i have, no it is not very hard. you do have to move fast to take the tension out of the other flying lines (how far in terms of distance depends on the size of the kite) but its not far, 10 -15 feet. there is tension initially, you have to clamp down hard on the line. but you have to do it. how else are you going to bring down your kite that just hooked the high outside line onto the wingtip during an odd bounce and is initiating a loop through the power zone and ripping your stake out of the ground when you are 1/2 way back to the bar (or to the kite). there are people downwind.


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:01 am 
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[/quote]Also would you not have to first hit the QR before the kite will flag out? The bar is tethered to something by the CL. That would mean you have to make it all the way back to the CL, hit the QR and then the kite will flag out?[/quote]

i think this is part you arent getting: transferring tension to a single line (and slacking the others) is how the kite becomes disabled, regardless of how that is accomplished. holding one line and running back toward the bar will effectivly shorten the line your holding and slack the other flying lines. it is the same effect as releasing the bar onto the leash line and reducing the tension to the single one line the leash is hooked to (or 2 lines in some bar systems (debatably effective).

if you arent at the harness loop to release it, while having the leash line secured to yourself (or something) then you have to be prepared to disable the kite regardless.

i have seen the front end of van spun 90 degrees, and a log the size of a dinner table chucked 40 feet downwind. everything we do in kiting works fine until that one time it doesn't.


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:27 am 
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A stake is normally not close to the water when it comes time to land your kite

Because in order to launch the kite sits closer the water where the wind is on side to side on winds

Nobody usually has a stake also near the water for emergency landing

What i am saying is that to land the kiter must go all the way inland to the same stake in the ground
...put kite at noon...then down to the original location of the launch..then detach etc etc.!!

Waaaaaaay too long of a production in my opinion especially in an emergency situation....
....to have to swing the kite overhead for a moment

I like to launch fast and precise
I like to land fast an precise as soon as i am out of the water...15 seconds..start to finish..LE down
.
Without detaching from chicken loop and leash
Everything stays nice and neat with me....no QR release needed for me in 3 years to land my kite

Rebel is my kite of choice for landing without use of QR (300 times) and no errors

If one day my life is in danger landing it is great to know i can use alternate QR 5th safety landing

.................................. :surf: :sun: ......................................................................................................


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 2:38 am 
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bnthere wrote:
yes i have, no it is not very hard. you do have to move fast to take the tension out of the other flying lines (how far in terms of distance depends on the size of the kite) but its not far, 10 -15 feet. there is tension initially, you have to clamp down hard on the line. but you have to do it. how else are you going to bring down your kite that just hooked the high outside line onto the wingtip during an odd bounce and is initiating a loop through the power zone and ripping your stake out of the ground when you are 1/2 way back to the bar (or to the kite). there are people downwind.


I did get what you were saying... I just don't believe it :lol:

So you have done it? ... how many times? how much wind we talking ? how big was the kite?


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 4:20 pm 
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its a standard training practice when teaching self launching techniques. you have to be able to disable the kite when things go wrong, including when you are 1/2 way between the bar and kite. it is effective, and doable. anything can be more difficult in extreme conditions, its a personal judgement call as to whether or not you are capable of doing what has to be done (if it has to be done) when the time comes in this sport. a rider needs to make that decision before attempting a launch. it can be done with a big canopy in high wind. i have done it in that situation before, and many times with a more "appropriate" sized canopy per wind strength.

if your curious, try it in light wind and work your way up. pro supervision always recommended when learning.


additionally: although holding the high inside line and putting some pressure on it during the walk back to the bar is effective in reducing the potential bouncing of the kite and can improve its behavior sitting on its wingtip, using the low inside line to disable onto usually keeps the kite closer to the ground and its flips through the air less as it "flags out". its a toss-up which you choose to use. just something to consider.


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:19 pm 
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Location: Ford Lake, Michigan
What I do is fly the kite backwards (pulling the rear leaders in remember when flying a kite backwards pulling left makes it fly right) until it is a few degrees downwind with the wingtip on the ground and then release the upper steering line, hold onto the bottom one. The reason for putting it down in the wind window instead of landing the kite on its wingtip at the edge of the wind window is that if you do whatever everyone else does (tip the kite by a sudden sharp tug on the center lines) the kite has a good possibility of tumbling downwind and hot launching, not that I am afraid of a hot launch but there are rocks and broken glass one meter downwind of my launch so I can't let it tumble. Once the kite is resting on an edge, keep holding the lower steering line, and reach up for the upper center line and pull on both the upper center line and the bottom steering line to put the kite in a nose down position. If your hand slips and you let go of the upper steering line the kite will stay put, and if your hand slips and you let go of the rear line the kite will jump forward to the normal edge of the wind window. This technique does not require any timing or any sudden jerk of the lines. I suppose you can also land the kite, and walk a bit upwind to put the kite a bit deeper in the window while it rests on the edge but my launches don't have that much room so I prefer to fly the kite backwards to set it down into the wind window. This landing technique is like the inverse of a light wind launch where you grab the opposite center line. Of course I prefer to hit the quick release on the water and wrap the lines so much safer and more convenient, but sometimes you know so much seaweed. Launching is never a problem kites want to fly, it's landing that is always tricky unless of course you have a 5 line kite like a rebel.


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 Post subject: Re: self landing with stake
PostPosted: Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:37 pm 
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Since we are now on self-landing without a stake......

http://www.ikiteboarding.com/uploads/selflandkite.avi


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