knotwindy wrote:and while you're at it, make these new better valves bigger
not just the inflate/deflate valve(you should only need one if done right to decrease the failure points and expense)
all the one pump valves as well with larger diameter tubes for faster easier inflate/deflate
why are we still using cheap ass little valves on a $2000 kite?
So they aren't $2005 kites?..knotwindy wrote:why are we still using cheap ass little valves on a $2000 kite?
Edt, that's a good idea, shows you're thinking. We thought that might work as well and have tested it. The issue is that the entire pvc valve has plasticizer that will eventually migrate out. Even if you are successful removing plastizer from the surface it will quickly return....so you're only delaying the inevitable.edt wrote:that's really interesting dan.
if what you say is true than the kite companies could fix these problems by doing a flash sear of the valves right before they go on the kites, what you can do is after the valves have been formed and plasticizer added, you heat sear them so that the outer micrometers of the valve lose their plasticizer . . .
This has been done. A major company offered valves out of polyurethane in 2007 and another kite company did it in 2011 and the valves dry out and crack within the first year. Polyurethane valves usually have a cloudy yellow tint to them and the yellow becomes more noticeable as they age. Valves didn't fall off but they couldn't handle everyday life.edt wrote:but maybe there is a production reason why a heat searing treatment won't work (maybe it would deform the valves.
or maybe instead of making the valves out of PVC with plasticizer added they could make the valves out of polyurethane (which is what the bladders are) and add hardener instead of softener
Think of plasticizer wicking like water wicks. When you weld pvc to pvc there is very little migration as both parts have plasticizer and there is no draw from one to the other. For this reason your $3 beach ball doesn't lose the valve.edt wrote:In any case it looks like the basic problem is that kite manufacturers have no control over the actual valve production they are using valves meant for beach balls, inflatable mattresses and rafts, and adapting them to their own use instead of developing a specific research and development project to produce a better valve.
I won't disagree with you because I think anything is possible if you spend enough time (and that equals money) trying to figure something out.edt wrote:there's absolutely no question this is a problem that could be solved if you hire a engineer and throw some money at it.
I did read your entire post and from what I read the Valve Trap is a replacement valve and doesn't address the problem with the original valve coming off. Did I miss something or have I miss understood the point of this thread?airtimekite wrote: Let me introduce the Valve Trap. The Valve Trap sandwiches a valve between two 4” diameter foam discs with a highly specialized adhesive that can tolerate plasticizers. The foam is soft enough to conform to any irregularities in the valve (think the ridges on the top of the valve base from the RF die) so it seals nicely. Also the valve has contact on double the surface area (top of valve base and bottom valve base). The Valve Trap then provides a 4” diameter base with a 'peel and stick' adhesive that will adhere to any bladder.
Ahh ok. But then wouldn't they have to be installed by hand thereby running up the costs? or maybe thats how the valves are installed at the factory now?... I have no idea.edt wrote:frankm what I suspect is that if airtime is successful in solving this problem eventually kite manufacturers will adopt the same tech . . . . just a matter of time
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