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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:40 pm 
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While I'm not in the business of rubbishing very other board designs out there, I will concur my new Mako King is an outstanding board. It really does work like described, and its performance does indeed defy logic. The concave and rocker is, well its just weird.

But it is indeed a smooth ride and I had I a guy who has only learnt in the past 6 months riding it strapless, his first time on a TT and indeed the first time strapless.

The other guy who has ridden it, is getting one. It is an outstanding cross over board.

It feels like a very small board underfoot, and I can throw down all my hooked in freeride stuff.

Not sure how well it goes in serious surf just yet. Loads really well and can go early but also can be ridden in much higher winds, the tight rails really bite.

I share your enthusiasm but to write off all other designs is somewhat limited.


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 2:50 pm 
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Joined: Sun May 15, 2011 5:57 am
Posts: 93
panchito wrote:
flaps1111 wrote:
Nobile 50fifty 2010. Best board ever, no spray, perfect balance 50-50 in each foot, total control in chopi water.
You are welcome.
:thumb:


Oh yeah ... specially catching waves and on the swell .... :rollgrin:

but then .... if you are happy with your TT , good for you ..


plummet wrote:
looks heavy. how much does it weigh?


Don´t have a digital scale but both Shinn´s are about 4,0 kilos , the Woody a bit more ( less than half a kilo more ) +/- complete with straps / pads & fins .

So .... believe it or not all 3 weigh the same ( or almost )


Regards

Franz

Yes mate I'm sure you're right, it looks a nice board and better for waves than a standar TT.
I was about to buy the mako king but just for the good reviews I read here, but I will never buy anything else without testing first. Last summer I demoed a Shin Monk I had read super good reviews of this board in this forum and in a uk forum, they say it was a smooth board, the best for chopy, landings....bla, bla I had 3 hours to test it but 15 min later I was switching to my board.

Demo first is the golden rule and maybe a old board suit you better than the last pimp model. There is a post of a dude asking for a 80's Frank Orly board, this sport is amazing


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:00 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 5:48 pm
Posts: 704
Location: Sailing the Seas of Cheese
Ummmm.............not callin' you out Panchito or starting some flame war, but you're WRONG WRONG WRONG. Saying the industry doesn't know wtf they're doing, but some custom wood mako shape is the holy grail? :lol: :lol: :lol:

Come on dude......you have to admit that's a little short sighted.

First consider your lineup of prior gear: your 2008 Nobile Shinns. Our crew of riders have owned the 134, 132 and 128 Shinns all 2008 same as yours. I rode mine for 2 1/2 years. One guy still uses his. It's not a bad board............but it's now very much outshined by more modern designs. Every board Nobile put out in 2008 spit water in your face like there was a fire hose attached to the front. My Shinn 134 was soooo fricken soft, sprayed your face and didn't exactly like to scream upwind, but it was fine. Certainly very good for a 2008 board.

Before you cast all other designers' decades of work, theory and proven innovations aside, you may want to step on something from this current decade. Try a modern Shinn (his company) like a Monk, or Supershinn, or a Nobile 2HD or the 2013 NHP - they are all fricken awesome by comparison. Automatic upwind, no spray, boost to the moon and work great in nasty chop.
(kiteboarding figured out that you can have rocker in board back in about 2009ish)

In fairness, I do get what you're saying though on a Mako type design. (Heck even a Jimmy Lewis!) It feels so different from everything else that it seems to be the board of choice. Sure they're fun for awhile because their different, but for my everyday ride I think I'm gonna stay with my current (MODERN) quiver of boards.

Anyway really who gives a rip what you're riding as long as you're having fun? Ride what you like.


Last edited by POACHER on Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:26 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 6:48 pm
Posts: 312
lost few minutes presciuos time reading this BS topic...


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:50 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2005 5:17 pm
Posts: 893
Location: jackson WY
This guy is stoked on his new board and wants to share his excitement. Why would you want to put out that fire? We are not talking politics here. spread the love! :cool2:


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:08 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 06, 2010 12:50 pm
Posts: 94
panchito wrote:
There is something I would like to share with you . I thought < after 8 years kiting , owning a total of 10 boards and having tried out probably 100 across all these years > I knew everything about " kite boards " shapes , sizes & styles just to learn recently that …

!!boy I was so wrong !!

So , let me start saying that most probably you ( middle age free rider ) are using an " ordinary " TT ? and you think you are happy with your board ? Well , I have bad news for you , the board you are using is crap , absolutely crap , you have been riding on totally wrong boards ( including me ) for all these years and it´s not your fault , the entire industry got stuck in one design direction 10 years ago and we all have been happy with it .

How the hell did I came to this conclusion ?

Well , let me show you my " usual suspects "
Attachment:
280.jpg



Attachment:
184.jpg


the first is an modern free rider board , the second is a mutant ( or better called : surf twin ) both are top of the line boards & Brand and although they are a few years old I haven´t tried out nothing new recently that gave me the feeling that there has been a design leap during the last 3-4 years …. till a few weeks back .

I´m not going to bother you with the hole story How I got this board and to be clear , it´s not in any terms an " unique " design or something revolutionary , as far as I was able to find out , this board is a " woody " version of the Ocean Rodeo Mako series that have been around since 2008 ? or so but I can list you the " specs "

- Massive rocker
- very little flex
- extreme rounded tips
- 15 mm concave
- twice the volume comparing to " standard " TT´s

Sounds terrible right ?

Ok, I will tell you a bit of the story behind this board ….. I felt in love with it back then in 2009 when John was developing it and saw the first pictures and thought , when I have some spare money , I´ll order one for me and finally did it 3 years latter.

Attachment:
IMG_0031.JPG


Attachment:
IMG_0032.JPG


I was not expecting nothing groundbreaking and I was convinced at that point , it will be my " third " board to play around once in a while and brag about it but mostly likely , I´ll keep it on top of a rack in my room nice clean and shinny …

So , I got the board , put it together when it arrived and luckily got the chance to try it out that same day on what we call : a typical Tarifa winter ( west wind) session with choppy water & heavy swell and you know what ? after 5 minutes I came to the conclusion that I most probably will never touch my other boards in my life since it outperforms them in almost every aspect .

This board " glides " on top of the chop and only on extreme conditions ( when you hit a wave full force ) there is 0 spray , nothing , nada , nichts , niente . really !!!!

Honestly , how many TT´s have you ridden that does not spray one bit ? I haven't .

My first session lasted 2 full hours without knee pain or painful quadriceps muscles ( specially on my back foot side ) it finished cause the wind died otherwise I would kept going on .

So … what is the secret ? at this point I must confess , I have no idea since this board just wiped off all the logic regarding board shapes I thought I knew about ,but the "package " works extremely well , with any standard TT you go upwind using the rails right ? well , with this board you don´t , you ride most of the time like on top of a surfboard so your body position is totally different , more relaxed , you need much less pressure on your back foot to tack upwind , it outperforms both my TT and my Mutant together in anyway you can imagine. It is a hole new experience and I am convinced , once you try one out , you'll probably won't want to ride your TT again .

Ok , Ok … on flat water a " regular " TT will perform better and as supposed , you need a kicker to be able to jump since a square tip " cuts " better compared a rounded one but on open water I have never experienced such an effortless and sweet ride in my entire life .

By the way , you can´t try them out and like me , you have to order them " blind " ( unless you live at the George and / or run across someone with a Bellacera on the beach but I´ll guess the Makos are more sprayed around and if you have any chance you should try them out before you make your next board purchase decision . It´s worth the try , believe me .

I will post a more detailed review about the woody at the review section the next few days , check it out .

Regards and have fun


Franz

PS. English is not my mother language so …..


It is the usual but seldom forum show from Panchito. Many years ago he was devoted to Slingshot. Then time came to say it was a complete crap and the new era for EH started. Hey, Panchito, tell us about your vision of EH now :o


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 6:10 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 23, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 1801
Location: Cape Cod, MA USA
panchito wrote:
There is something I would like to share with you . I thought < after 8 years kiting , owning a total of 10 boards and having tried out probably 100 across all these years > I knew everything about " kite boards " shapes , sizes & styles just to learn recently that …

!!boy I was so wrong !!

So , let me start saying that most probably you ( middle age free rider ) are using an " ordinary " TT ? and you think you are happy with your board ? Well , I have bad news for you , the board you are using is crap , absolutely crap , you have been riding on totally wrong boards ( including me ) for all these years and it´s not your fault , the entire industry got stuck in one design direction 10 years ago and we all have been happy with it .

How the hell did I came to this conclusion ?

Well , let me show you my " usual suspects "
Attachment:
280.jpg



Attachment:
184.jpg


the first is an modern free rider board , the second is a mutant ( or better called : surf twin ) both are top of the line boards & Brand and although they are a few years old I haven´t tried out nothing new recently that gave me the feeling that there has been a design leap during the last 3-4 years …. till a few weeks back .

I´m not going to bother you with the hole story How I got this board and to be clear , it´s not in any terms an " unique " design or something revolutionary , as far as I was able to find out , this board is a " woody " version of the Ocean Rodeo Mako series that have been around since 2008 ? or so but I can list you the " specs "

- Massive rocker
- very little flex
- extreme rounded tips
- 15 mm concave
- twice the volume comparing to " standard " TT´s

Sounds terrible right ?

Ok, I will tell you a bit of the story behind this board ….. I felt in love with it back then in 2009 when John was developing it and saw the first pictures and thought , when I have some spare money , I´ll order one for me and finally did it 3 years latter.

Attachment:
IMG_0031.JPG


Attachment:
IMG_0032.JPG


I was not expecting nothing groundbreaking and I was convinced at that point , it will be my " third " board to play around once in a while and brag about it but mostly likely , I´ll keep it on top of a rack in my room nice clean and shinny …

So , I got the board , put it together when it arrived and luckily got the chance to try it out that same day on what we call : a typical Tarifa winter ( west wind) session with choppy water & heavy swell and you know what ? after 5 minutes I came to the conclusion that I most probably will never touch my other boards in my life since it outperforms them in almost every aspect .

This board " glides " on top of the chop and only on extreme conditions ( when you hit a wave full force ) there is 0 spray , nothing , nada , nichts , niente . really !!!!

Honestly , how many TT´s have you ridden that does not spray one bit ? I haven't .

My first session lasted 2 full hours without knee pain or painful quadriceps muscles ( specially on my back foot side ) it finished cause the wind died otherwise I would kept going on .

So … what is the secret ? at this point I must confess , I have no idea since this board just wiped off all the logic regarding board shapes I thought I knew about ,but the "package " works extremely well , with any standard TT you go upwind using the rails right ? well , with this board you don´t , you ride most of the time like on top of a surfboard so your body position is totally different , more relaxed , you need much less pressure on your back foot to tack upwind , it outperforms both my TT and my Mutant together in anyway you can imagine. It is a hole new experience and I am convinced , once you try one out , you'll probably won't want to ride your TT again .

Ok , Ok … on flat water a " regular " TT will perform better and as supposed , you need a kicker to be able to jump since a square tip " cuts " better compared a rounded one but on open water I have never experienced such an effortless and sweet ride in my entire life .

By the way , you can´t try them out and like me , you have to order them " blind " ( unless you live at the George and / or run across someone with a Bellacera on the beach but I´ll guess the Makos are more sprayed around and if you have any chance you should try them out before you make your next board purchase decision . It´s worth the try , believe me .

I will post a more detailed review about the woody at the review section the next few days , check it out .

Regards and have fun


Franz

PS. English is not my mother language so …..


Franz,

What size is your woody mako? Is it better than an OR Mako, or the same? Do you always ride with mutant fin setup?

Thx,

Ed


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 8:06 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2011 4:49 am
Posts: 385
i have had one of John's boards for about 3 years and it rocks. Handles chop and swell better than any TT i have tried. A tt would be better in butter but otherwise it is smooth and relaxed and the stance is much more comfortable. It has a better low end than the Mako and about the same top end, so overall a better range. Also goes up wind like crazy, almost as good as a thruster surfboard. If you rode it with the tri-fin setup it would probably be the same. I just use the mid size fin on one end and the Mako surf fin on the other. Keeps it looser and spinny but still holds in the swell and small waves. Also holds an edge to boost big once you get the timing. overall a very fun board for fee riding and small surf and swell. Obviously not as good as a true surfboard for pure wave riding with a smaller kite but opens up all kinds of other options in the waves, so a small trade off and better in junky waves for jumps and powered up riding. Luckily i do not have to choose but if i could only have one board for everything, this is the one.
the one I have is 143 x 40 but it rides smaller.


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:29 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:26 am
Posts: 275
Hey Panchito :)
I understand when you say industry gets stuck on design shapes... Surfing has done the same thing and still doing it if you go deep into design history, just look up Bob Simmons and the 'Mini Simmons' they were very fast surfboards but industry said 'NO' we will follow the long 'Slow' traditional design... Thats why there are long boards that need only be half the length. My friend designed the Leg rope but was Shunned because it didnt suit tradition at the time ???


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 Post subject: Re: 8 years kiting and I was so wrong about boards
PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2012 12:08 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 30, 2012 11:25 am
Posts: 2253
Yes I wasn't going to say this but your shinn boards are indeed an outdated design. I rode both of these boards and didn't rate them either. The mutant was average compared to my cardboard wave. Infact the early shinn boards were okay, but very average compared to what is produced now. It is not a fair comparison. Let me give you one as I also have a shinn monk.

You talk about smoothness and chop control. The mako is a smooth ride in chop until and certain point. When the chop gets to a certain level, driven by wind and a slightly larger swell, the board needs to be ridden slower. It is after all a very rigid board.

But the new monks can still be ridden flat out at incredible speeds and is still very comfortable. Very controllable. The mako has its limits I have found. The shinn has none.

But the mako is obviously better in waves, unless you like to ride powered crash and smash TT style with big ass heel side carves, then again the monk wins. Oh and splash, the monk also wins in the heavier chop.


Hence why I have both boards.

What is incredible about the mako is when you ride it back the other way there is no change in technique, none at all. Sometimes I have to remind myself I am riding thruster fins forward. This is an amazing part of this board. Also strapless the king is so easy and sooo much fun.

The point of this post I hope is to let people know they should give the mako a crack, make up your own mind.

It serves certain riders like myself who are principally TT, mutant riders or a SB rider who wants to have another dimension on certain days in the waves. Then again not sure I will ever take my SB out again...after riding the mako.


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