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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:44 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:26 am
Posts: 275
Fishpole it at the begining of the loop which is after the pop..
Try watching lenton or hadlow in super slow motion.
The funniest thing about this move - is that you dont get to see much except the sky lol


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:02 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:05 pm
Posts: 478
Location: Maui
Push the bar out??


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:21 am 
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Yes - push the bar out, if slow off the bottom !
You can experiment with this while riding in a straight line in very low winds for the kite you plan on looping - play with the bar position to find fastest way back up to 12 after diving and turning the kite to the water line, and great skill for very light winds too.
When youve truly got that down - youll see it know whats going on in your loops...


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 8:38 am 
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Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 5693
Location: Denmark
Hi Rightguard

What most says - namely start with a very little rotation, as when you pull the bar you will accelerate your rotation, so most likely will you end up over rotating many times.

Just do a normal jump, but with so little back rotation that you would normally land on your back.

Dont just pull the kite around in one move - this will lead to hazardous hard landings way too often, and very unreliable from jump to jump.
Start by doing a normal jump and let the kite sit around 12 for just a split second (pause), and THEN you pull the rear end of the bar fully.
The pause is not noticeable seen from the outside, but it makes a huge difference and you will be in total control.

Trim the kite down a bit - as it will fly better around if not too high tension on the rear lines, and you will also have much better control in the landing.

I never ever fishpole - it does not make sense to me, as you lose all control over the sheeting (power or AOA) then :o
If unhooked it is fine as some find it looks cool - but that is another issue, and here you have lost your sheeting control anyway.

The backloop kiteloop is the easiest loop of all, as your landing will be downwind and smooth - and can be one of the most "gracefull if you dont want it to be smack - pow - bam only :D
And you come out with lines untwisted too :naughty:

Can be done easily with big kites, I often do it on 12m2 or even bigger when occasionally out on 13/14, and also on a raceboard in super light wind - really fun.

An old video from the winther 2010 where Peer and I are out in drysuits for the first time so very rusty but just enjoying "beeing out there" and have a mellow time - extremely boring to watch I know, was trying an old lower quality kitecam, but you can go to 2:25 and from there you will see 3 backloop kiteloops as seen from the kite.

Very easy to see how the kite and me just flows around in sync the 360 degree - I like to throw them like this when the water is almost ice ha haa :rollgrin:
Easy to see on the watertrails up-down how the landing is very downwind thus soft - that comes by itself and this is why the backroll kiteloop is not nearly as hard as just a kiteloop without body rotation.

Maybe it can give you an idea - although it looks soooo different than seen from the ground, where the kite loops fully around and it looks "tough" - but seen from the kite it is ooooh so sweet and gentle, right ?

When you get better, you can go for super high jumps - and wait till at the apex before you loop the kite.
The backroll rotation can be way more difficult then, because you can under or overrotate much easier when up high - but this could be your next goal when the basics are in place Rightguard.


I only added this video back then because it was amazing and odd that a small hail and snowstorm came by for 5 minutes only - and could be heard on the canvas - and then it left again

http://vimeo.com/10218675



:D Peter


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:37 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 1:00 am
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Location: World (KF Admin)
1. don't ride fast, go slower
2. steer the kite slowly over the zenith
3. pop and do the backroll, but slower than a backroll without kiteloop. Fly a bit.
4. only give the roll so much power, that you do half a roll
5. then steer the bar hard, and the kiteloop starts. Its pull will make you rotate the other half.
6. keep looping, don't stop the loop! Until it looped and catched you
7. land with the board pointing downwind for a faster landing

Tips:
- pull on the bar with one hand only, this way you have more feeling for the kite and loop.
- have your hand closer to the middle of the bar, this will give you more control and you still can loop it. (I do this also with my 18!)

Please come back here and tell us if you landed it!


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 10:43 am 
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Joined: Sat Aug 29, 2009 11:25 pm
Posts: 2562
Location: The Naki
I'm a freestyle retard with gak style and no fluidity when I do moves.

But I do enjoy a back role kiteloop every now and then.

Cool thing is your lines aren't twisted after the move.

I can't offer much advice apart from agreeing with Toby on the one handed loop using the other hand to stabalise or grab a board during the move.

Quite nice to use a bit of chop to lob a nice lazy bit of air and instigate the role.

I should grow a pair and throw one on a wave face that would be cool if i could land back on the face. my gakness would probably prevent such an event happening though.


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:17 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2003 1:00 am
Posts: 174
just to add - a cool thing about this move is you can still learn / do it in pretty light / marginal winds

i just use my backhand then do a half-backroll and kinda pause for a second facing straight upwind until the kite pulls you out of the rotation ...

over-rotating and landing toeside feels good :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:55 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 1:00 am
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Location: World (KF Admin)
Yes, stylish trick!
Add a grab to make it even more stylish!

Great to lift off a wave, rotate really slow, loop, and drop back into the wave...pure style!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 11:59 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 21, 2010 1:11 am
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Location: Puerto Rico
Ive heard it called the "e-16".


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 Post subject: Re: Back roll with loop?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 05, 2013 12:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2009 7:05 pm
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Location: Maui
The thing is, I can land it every once and a while, I just don't really know what I'm doing. Plus sometimes I come in supper hot and hurt myself. Just trying to understand the subtleties of the trick.

Do you let out the bar once the loop is completed...
Keep pulling on the bar until you land... Or what


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