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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:17 pm 
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sharky79 wrote:
700$ kite ?
This means that the number of kitesurfers will double :o
It's going to get even worth... no room anymore.

BTW if Naish is still making money on a 700$ kite then why just now ? why not two years ago ? why not 5 years ago ? it's basically the same tech for 6-7 years now...


They make far more money than you would think. Just because they chose to spend a lot on Riders doesn't detract away from the fact that kites cost under/around $100 to make and deliver.


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 4:53 pm 
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Tone wrote:
kites cost under/around $100 to make and deliver.


Spoken like someone who has never built anything in his entire life. Have you ever ridden a Walmart skateboard? The first time you land a jump, both trucks and the board break into pieces. That's what a $100 kite would be like. No stainless steel, cheap stamped iron, no dyneema sk75 cheap twisted polyester, no teijin t9600, waxed cotton for the canopy and the whole thing held together with cotton thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:45 pm 
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I have seen an invoice for kites from china. A well known brand. The bag for the kite costs sometimes up to 50% of the cost of the kite (size depending).


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:45 pm 
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I have seen an invoice for kites from china. A well known brand. The bag for the kite costs sometimes up to 50% of the cost of the kite (size depending).


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:56 pm 
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Tone wrote:
I have seen an invoice for kites from china. A well known brand. The bag for the kite costs sometimes up to 50% of the cost of the kite (size depending).

I've seen the invoices for many brands the bag costs them 10 bucks and kites cost 600


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:00 pm 
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You're way off bud.


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:20 pm 
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Tone wrote:
You're way off bud.


You're way off bro. Every dealer I know would go out of business if they had to rely on the profit margin of kites. They make their juice off lessons and stuff like clothing or snowboards.


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:48 pm 
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Tone wrote:
I have seen an invoice for kites from china. A well known brand. The bag for the kite costs sometimes up to 50% of the cost of the kite (size depending).


I am willing to bet that you are wrong in your estimation. I have not seen an invoice, but obviously I could just say I have and claimed that the price was higher. There is no proof in just claiming.


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:29 pm 
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That's fine you think I might be wrong.

when trade on a 12m kite is £550 from importer, how much do you really think the brand is making?


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 Post subject: Re: Naish mid-season catalog reveals no-strut kite!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 10:49 pm 
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Blake wrote:
Bingo!
Zob and Zact both nailed it right on the head....Naish are trying to capitalize on the work of Board Riding Maui by rushing "their" strutless kite to market, hence the one size only.


I am not going to speculate about intentions of other people / companies, but to be fair, the Fly came in one size, the Ride and Parks were introduced in 3 sizes so this is not unheard of for naish to introduce something in few sizes.

It is pretty common across industries that things are developed in parallel because it might be a "natural" next step. I do think it is awesome what Greg has done, and I can understand why other companies would explore that idea. Greg was definitely first to market, but the idea has been fluttering in the industry. I think what Greg did was make it work. A tight design and a canopy that fits the frame has been the big differentiator. He also did expose that there is a market for simplicity. I have only ridden 8 cloud once, but really enjoyed it.

Every single person I have had try my ride has liked the kite. Every one. One of my best buddies resisted for the longest time. Even when his wife tried the kite and liked it...he ended up getting one and now prefer it over all the other kites he has.

If you look at the Ride which is a Naish kite you'd see much of the same in terms of design. It has a canopy that fits the frame, there is no need for a lot of extra battens and 7 struts because the kite has a very tightly designed canopy. For me personally if you had presented a no strut kite when I was still on my 7 strut raven I would have said NO F$$#ing WAY!! For me riding the Park, then the Ride has opened my mind to the idea. So in that sense Naish has been part of opening this market. The kiteboarding market is like surfing...very conservative. The point being that it all the variables matter.

I am not saying what is right or wrong, I am just trying to illustrate that there are many variables at play. I do think there is room for both...

Personally I really like the idea, and I think this definitely has a future in the sport...actually more than a future. I think this is the future...for parts of the industry. The implementation doesn't have to be completely strutless, but light weight, and much tighter designs. The pack down that Naish is making a point of is not trivial...to me that is huge.

I love the commitment Boardriding maui is showing, and the videos are killer!! I am so happy about this development that I am giddy. I am still going to order drafts too...because for the racing application it makes sense to have a more complex kite (high AR).

In relation to what Starsky said I agree with a lot of things, but I think the strutless has a market for more general applications. Not only light wind. I would say making a light kite for drift on a wave make so much sense. It also means we can ride a medium sized kite in medium to light wind and kite kite can drift.

either way this was a way too long post. I need more coffee.


Last edited by tautologies on Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:09 am, edited 1 time in total.

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