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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 5:07 am 
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Since it's a North, I'd start by checking the valves seal with the bladder.


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:35 pm 
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Puetz wrote:
Michelks wrote:
I found two holes when it had 6 psi pressure, as soon as i took the bldder out and inflated it again I couldnt find the holes anymore, i put 3 patches in the area i presumed they were but didnt work out. 6psi pressure and they were at the same place. I just cant believe it, the kite is brand new, never used.


... yeah that sucks abit! Maybe its a shit happens situation, you never know maybe something rubbed against it?? Anyway, quick question, where roughly are the holes?

I've had many tiny holes over the years and its soooo hard to find them when the bladder is out of the kite. Logically its because you can't put enough pressure in to make the tiny holes open enough to make the bubbles show up easily.

One way to find it is to put the bladder back in the kite and pump up to full pressure, spray soap on and when you find them, dry as best you can with a rag then get a marker pen and put a dot right over the hole which hopefully the ink will 'leak' through the LE onto the bladder. I know its not ideal but it can work.

Another way is to again find the holes as done originally, then take bladder out and pump up and squeeze in your hand either side the area and put under water in a pool, then with great patiences, wait for a little bubble to show and importantly have a friend close by to quickly mark with a pen as you find it.

Once bladder is out, soapy water over area then place finger (as if you are pointing at something) and run it over where you think the hole is, back and forth and up and down, slowly. The fact that you have your finger on bladder you can create a surface tesion for the soap to build up a bigger bubble, and therefore show up easier, it sort of simulates as if its pumped up to a higher pressure. Again, pen ready to mark the exact spot.

Good luck,

Robbie :)




Valves are ok , both holes are in the first quarter of the kite, close to the deflate valve, one on the black strip, and the other 3 cm up. I tried to mark a pen dot , but didin´t work.
Now that the bladder is out again I will repeat everything pointing with my finger, if I dont find anything I will put larger patches(7 X 10 cm) in the area. and pray .

With bladder inside what can go wrong if I I make the hole larger with a needle? better then tomahawking isn´t it?

About the kite:
it´s exactly what Toby told you, the kite has thinner leading edge, what makes it very light, and it folds very easily when you put your weight over it( even when 6 or 7 psi pumped). It´s not stiff as my rebel 14.

The wind was 2/5 knots and some times 5 knots steady , all I could do was 3 reverse launches (on sand), and the kite was up very easily, and turned 180 very fast (compared to my FS21).
With the original setting and the 4 line bar,I couldn´t keep the kite parked in the air for more then 30sec, even at zenith or 2 o clock. ( only Dimitri is able to do that on a SUP. rsrs). If I didint had the problem with pressure i would have tested other setups.

That was all the fun I had during the weekend (rsrs) , as soon i test the kite I´ll keep you informed.

Cheers


Last edited by Michelks on Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:38 pm 
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these are the hole pics


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furo1.JPG
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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 4:29 pm 
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Location: DownUnder/Brazil cumbuco-oceanview.com
Michelks wrote:
I found two holes when it had 6 psi pressure, as soon as i took the bldder out and inflated it again I couldnt find the holes anymore, i put 3 patches in the area i presumed they were but didnt work out. 6psi pressure and they were at the same place. I just cant believe it, the kite is brand new, never used.


Ola Amigo,

When I unpacked my new Fuse, one spot of the canopy was almost rubbed through by one of the hard plastic pieces. Luckily it is still ok.
Sao Paulo? I can't help you there unfortunately.

Cheers
Caesar 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:08 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 04, 2009 2:37 pm
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Caesar wrote:
Michelks wrote:
I found two holes when it had 6 psi pressure, as soon as i took the bldder out and inflated it again I couldnt find the holes anymore, i put 3 patches in the area i presumed they were but didnt work out. 6psi pressure and they were at the same place. I just cant believe it, the kite is brand new, never used.


Ola Amigo,

When I unpacked my new Fuse, one spot of the canopy was almost rubbed through by one of the hard plastic pieces. Luckily it is still ok.
Sao Paulo? I can't help you there unfortunately.

Cheers
Caesar 8)



Thank you Caesar. I followed your fuse´s post and saw you live in Fortaleza. Lucky you that don´t need to drive 150 km to ride an 18 or 21 meters kite in 8 knots wind.


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Mon Apr 29, 2013 7:16 pm 
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Location: DownUnder/Brazil cumbuco-oceanview.com
Michelks wrote:
Caesar wrote:
Michelks wrote:
I found two holes when it had 6 psi pressure, as soon as i took the bldder out and inflated it again I couldnt find the holes anymore, i put 3 patches in the area i presumed they were but didnt work out. 6psi pressure and they were at the same place. I just cant believe it, the kite is brand new, never used.


Ola Amigo,

When I unpacked my new Fuse, one spot of the canopy was almost rubbed through by one of the hard plastic pieces. Luckily it is still ok.
Sao Paulo? I can't help you there unfortunately.

Cheers
Caesar 8)



Thank you Caesar. I followed your fuse´s post and saw you live in Fortaleza. Lucky you that don´t need to drive 150 km to ride an 18 or 21 meters kite in 8 knots wind.



hahaha, come up! :wink:

Cheers
Caesar 8)


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:19 am 
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Location: Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia
Michelks wrote:
these are the hole pics


... man thats very familiar look, I've seen many times. :o

One of the problems I forgot mention is that the LE material is very good at holding air also. So what can happen is that the air bubbles can travel along and show itself in a spot not exactly where the hole is! Oh damn it he says!

I had exactly that happen a little while ago with my Dyno LE and in the end I did what you said, put a large patch over the area I thought the hole was located. It worked fine this time but it didn't work out for me when I did the same technique on a strut. Pulled the damn thing in and out so many times til I finally found the damn thing as a big patch missed its target. Lucky for me it was only a strut but the LE is a pain to take in and out.

I look forward to you fixing it so you can let us know how you get on with the kite!

cheers,

Robbie :)


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:41 am 
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Location: Vancouver, Canada. rides Naish,Ozone,North, Spotz,Aguera
I have fixed a lot of bladders, here are some hints.

-As described above, pump up the kite and spray it with soapy water. The bubbles you get on the outside of an inflated kite indicate roughly where the holes are but not exactly. Air can travel several cm inside the leading edge material.

-Don't remove the bladder if you don't have to. Often you can pull the enough bladder out the zipper hole to access the suspect area. Sometimes you have to detach a strut hose to do this.

-Pump up the badder when it is outside (or partly outside) the kite and spray it with soapy water to see if you can see bubbles. You have to put a lot of pressure in the bladder until it starts to develop big bulges. Have a felt pen ready to mark the hole when you find it.

-Don't patch an area without finding the hole first.. your chance is success would be small.

-You soapy water should be very soapy, maybe 1 part soap to 10 parts water. I use dish washing soap.

-If you don't like soapy water, listening for a leak often works if is quiet. Another technique is feeling the air escape.. use you face (your lip area is quite sensitive).

There is no such thing as a hole that you cannot see. Once you have found the hole by the techniques above, you will see it visually.

:wink: CG


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Tue Apr 30, 2013 10:29 am 
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JOB DONE!!
Since I knew the area the holes were (close to deflate valve) , I tied with a rope the two sides of the bladder, one just before the valve and the other one meter ahead, I pumped the bladder using the deflate , and started to check with the spray soap , no bubbles(may be to much water) but I could feel the air going out when i approached my face , then with the back of my hand I found the hole, when I tried with the palm of the hand i couldn't feel it, the back is much more sensitive. The second one was easy. Tested and approved.
Thank you guys, I wouldn't have done that without help and advices.
Cheers
Michel


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 Post subject: Re: Fuse 2013 losing pressure
PostPosted: Thu May 02, 2013 11:55 pm 
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Location: Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia
Michelks wrote:
JOB DONE!!
Since I knew the area the holes were (close to deflate valve) , I tied with a rope the two sides of the bladder, one just before the valve and the other one meter ahead, I pumped the bladder using the deflate , and started to check with the spray soap , no bubbles(may be to much water) but I could feel the air going out when i approached my face , then with the back of my hand I found the hole, when I tried with the palm of the hand i couldn't feel it, the back is much more sensitive. The second one was easy. Tested and approved.
Thank you guys, I wouldn't have done that without help and advices.
Cheers
Michel


... cool as man, good result.

What do you think of the kite, any more opinions?? :D


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