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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:35 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 1:17 am
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Location: Save a life...adopt a Pitbull
I read it correctly, and understand exactly what I read.
We all have a buddy we can whip out when we need one.
Your message says Renegades invert, when two of your three kites are Renegades, and last week you said Dimitri makes great flying kites, make up your mind.
At this point, you look like you're just pulling stuff out of your as.s to make whatever point you so badly think needs making.
All kite companies end up with a few customers who are not happy and want free stuff, and some get it.. if what they say makes sense to the company...and some don't.
Your bar is fine, you said you didn't want the strap offered, and you say you like your kites,
...don't know what you're trying to accomplish.
You think you're going to pistol whip Dimitri into seeing things the way you see things?
Good luck with that.


Last edited by Oldnbroken on Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:05 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 4:48 am 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
alexeyga
Once again, we never had any problem with any EPIC kites inverting or jelly fishing. If I had problems I would never put them on the market. This only happens when your kite is not pumped properly. All EPIC kites Leading Edge need to be pumped hard at least (10.5 psi) in order for the kite to perform the way they are suppose to perform. Some people pump the kites to 6 psi which works but the best performance will be around 10.5 psi. But something to remember. If you pump it that hard and you plan to try new tricks and crash the kite a lot, then make sure to leave the "elastic" off on the "Inflate" valve in case your kite falls hard on the water. I am sure you don't want your LE to explode.
I had another customer with the same issue. So I told him to put more air in his kite at least 10.5 psi. Guess what!!!! Problem resolved. He sent me an email thinking me for taking the time to respond to his issue.
Any way these are some of the colors of the RENEGADE (4G) kites which will be coming out to the market soon.
This is an email I received few days ago from a customer.


Attachments:
IMG_2048 4.jpg
IMG_2048 4.jpg [ 299.25 KIB | Viewed 237 times ]
RENEGADE 4G bag.jpg
RENEGADE 4G bag.jpg [ 399.03 KIB | Viewed 237 times ]
Happy customer.jpg
Happy customer.jpg [ 164.25 KIB | Viewed 237 times ]


Last edited by Dimitri M on Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 8:38 am 
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Posts: 12
Long time reader, first time poster.

Firstly Dimitri, if you are going to blank out the names of kite companies that your "customer" has "sent" you please try to blank them out properly as we can clearly read the name of North and Liquid Force. The fact that your "customer" has singled out two of the most established companies both of which produce some of the best equipment I have used in 11 years of kiting makes me wonder about the validity of your "customer's" email and identity.

There are a number of Epic riders at my local beach so I am familiar with the products. The kites seem great although bridal wear does seem to be a problem (easily fixed I know but irritating if your kite is out of action). The bar is terrible. I have seen the new one, and whilst the chicken loop is improved greatly the rest of the bar continues to look cheap and nasty. Poor foam which was already pinched and chipped, nasty non marine grade screws which already show signs of rust. The last thing I want to see when I'm hanging onto a kite in 30 knots is a bar with rust. As you have brought up North in your "customer's" email you may want to take a look at their 2013 bar which is light years ahead of the new Epic bar and sets industry standards in quality and safety.

This is constructive criticism, Oldnbroken you needn't bother replying to this post. As far as I'm concerned you have no credibility as you are clearly in the employ of Epic.


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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 10:30 am 
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Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2007 9:58 pm
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Location: the netherlands / Epic Affiliated
Personally i semi agree about the bar.

Compeared to the North Bar 2013 the epic bar is cheap looking. But the bar does what it supossed to do. The new CL and flag system is definitly a great improvement. But the bar itself is simple but effective.
The foam feels good :baby: and personally i dont have any problems with the foam even on my 2010 bars :thumb: . Around the center hole it does have more to suffer, but later the centerhole got bigger and giving less damage. The new centerhole is better protected and the CL locks in the centerhole.
As said the bar is simple but does exactly that what it supossed to do.

The damage shown by Ceasar i can only imagine happened by pure neglect. :cry:

I do hope the next bar will evolve towards something like Ocean Rodeo :thumb: or maybe even a north bar :thumb: :thumb: . But with the same compfy feeling of the current bar :baby: . The worst possible choice for me would be to use some of the materials other brands do. Like the horrible slingshot grip, i rather NOT kite then hold a bar that uncompfortable :bye: .
I noticed the North bar that some testers had tape around the bar for a better feel kinda gave me the idea it wasnt a nice feeling grip. :?:
The epic bar needs to evolve :roll: with other brands but again it does what it supossed to do :D .

About a jellyfishing kite :angryfire: . I had that twice. Both times the kites were not pumped hard enough. I thought i did but warm day cool water crashing the kite a few times and the LE was a little softer.
I personally pump te kites hard but nowhere near as hard as Dimitri does and i have no problems with jellyfishing.

This ofcourse doesnt say you dont have this happening, but the first idea that pops into mind is not pumped enough. If thats not the case i suggest to e-mail Dimitri personally and give a detailed analyse of the problem. :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:11 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2010 6:58 pm
Posts: 623
I´m using the same QR model as Ceaser and it´s an accident waiting to happen – once under tension there is no consistency for the force required to open it, sometime it´s doable, sometimes it´s not

it reminds me of the Toyota brake saga, guess we need someone to die for a non functional design of a primary security system to not be taken so lightly

Kitesurf is an extreme sport but things are not as raw as it used to be, plenty of families enjoying the sport


PS
industry wise is about time for those bar ends to be streamlined and not jamming a line


Last edited by Tiago1973 on Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:48 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:49 pm 
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Posts: 506
About jellyfishing..

when i pump my epics all people around are looking me like i am crazy :roll: :!: saying :what are you doing ?it is going to explode!!!my answer..its an epic :thumb: ...dont worry ... worry for yours...needless to say how much beating i give to my kites :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 1:00 am
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
Quote:
Long time reader, first time poster.
Firstly Dimitri, if you are going to blank out the names of kite companies that your "customer" has "sent" you please try to blank them out properly as we can clearly read the name of North and Liquid Force. The fact that your "customer" has singled out two of the most established companies both of which produce some of the best equipment I have used in 11 years of kiting makes me wonder about the validity of your "customer's" email and identity.
There are a number of Epic riders at my local beach so I am familiar with the products. The kites seem great although bridal wear does seem to be a problem (easily fixed I know but irritating if your kite is out of action). The bar is terrible. I have seen the new one, and whilst the chicken loop is improved greatly the rest of the bar continues to look cheap and nasty. Poor foam which was already pinched and chipped, nasty non marine grade screws which already show signs of rust. The last thing I want to see when I'm hanging onto a kite in 30 knots is a bar with rust. As you have brought up North in your "customer's" email you may want to take a look at their 2013 bar which is light years ahead of the new Epic bar and sets industry standards in quality and safety.
This is constructive criticism, Oldnbroken you needn't bother replying to this post. As far as I'm concerned you have no credibility as you are clearly in the employ of Epic.

Hello KLK and thank you for posting your thoughts. You are the one that mentioned the name of these 2 companies not me. Sorry but it was 12:55 am when I post this so here you go I hide it better now. Let me know if you like this version better.
Concerning the bar, before you start bashing our new 4G EPIC bar that is not out yet you need to know the entire story behind it. If you want you can email me and I let you know what we are working on.
Concerning the email I do ask my customers if they don't mind using their emails before I post them to the public. Most of them do agree because they want people to know the truth and they don't want to waist their time posting things on the forums so they let me do it for them. The only thing they ask me is to hide their identity.
Concerning "Oldnbroken" from my understanding he has few other kite brands that he flies and has 2 or 3 EPIC kites in his quiver. So he is a good person to get advices from especially with the experience he has. If I were you I would listen more to what he has to say. And "YES" you are right he has a strong personality from what I see and he will says something when it comes down to a product that he believes in, no matter what brand it is. So voila, let me know if there is anything else I can help you with.

Also about this customer's bar on the email he sent me. I am sure its not the new 2013 Bar because yes NORTH has a great bar this year same as few other kite companies.


Attachments:
Happy customer.jpg
Happy customer.jpg [ 165.28 KIB | Viewed 296 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:43 pm 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
Tiago1973
This is our new (4G) Chicken Loop we have been working for a long time to replace the other CL we were borrowing from another kite company. It takes 2 seconds to reset this CL. Even a dog can do this.
:thumb:



Last edited by Dimitri M on Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 1:46 pm 
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Location: Montreal, Canada / NJ, USA
Dimitri M wrote:
alexeyga
Once again, we never had any problem with any EPIC kites inverting or jelly fishing. If I had problems I would never put them on the market. This only happens when your kite is not pumped properly. All EPIC kites Leading Edge need to be pumped hard at least (10.5 psi) in order for the kite to perform the way they are suppose to perform. Some people pump the kites to 6 psi which works but the best performance will be around 10.5 psi. But something to remember. If you pump it that hard and you plan to try new tricks and crash the kite a lot, then make sure to leave the "elastic" off on the "Inflate" valve in case your kite falls hard on the water. I am sure you don't want your LE to explode.


Dimitri, please feel free joining the "learning to read Club" along with your pall OldBroken. I have never said that ALL your kites are inverting or jellyfishing. The only thing that I have ever said was that this particular 9m Renegade of by buddy's has an issue. And it was getting worse over time. Nothing more, nothing less! Since 9m is one of the most used kite sizes, if there was a design problem - I'm sure we'd have heard a lot more about these inverting. Hence i've contacted you regarding that issue. And like i've told you in e-mail, i've personally made sure that the kite is pumped up rock hard, and I've personally checked all owner's bars - if the lines are all equal. Maybe the bridal got stretched, maybe there was something going on with the canopy - I don't know and guess what? Your "Epic" support wasn't of much help either!

And by the way, the only reason i've wrote about that inverting 3G Renegade 9, isn't to bash the kite, but to share my experience about how you're resolving real issues. Nothing more - nothing less!

Feel free to post more videos about that new chicken loop of yours - it surely looks like da ultimate solution to all above-mentioned issues!!!

Thank you!


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 Post subject: Re: Epic Kites 3rd Generation. 3G II
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:02 pm 
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Location: OUTER BANKS (NC) USA. Owner of EPICKITES
alexeyga,
Can yo please email me again because to tell you the truth I don't know who I'm talking to and it will be nice to receive an email from you so I can put two and two together. Because if that was the case with your friend's kite and still it would not work I would of ask him to send it back so I can check it like I do with few other customers that have minor problems with their kites or bars or boards.
For example I had a customer from Switzerland few months ago that had a problem with his RENEGADE 11 steering to the right. So he contacted me and we tried to figure out why this was happening and nothing seemed to work via email and phone. So I asked him if he could send the kite back for me to check. So he did and I realized that the end of the his LE was twisted. So I fixed it and sent him a video of me flying the kite and told him it was fixed. Since then this happy customer has got 2 more kites and 1 board.
So I am sorry but don't know what else to tell you but I am sure you are going to be very impressed with the new 4G EPIC bar. Will post the final 4G BAR & CL video very soon so you guys get a better idea of what's coming.


Last edited by Dimitri M on Fri Jun 14, 2013 2:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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