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 Post subject: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 2:29 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 1:56 am
Posts: 72
Hi all,

I was taking a lesson the other day in light wind, and was having trouble figuring out the timing to sheet in and out while sining/figure-8ing. I get the feeling it's like this:

Kite on the upstroke, moving through apex with some momentum: start to sheet in
Kite at middle of the downstroke: continuing to sheet in
Kite at bottom of the downstroke: fully sheeted in
Kite moving upstroke: start sheeting out
Kite through middle of upstroke: almost entirely sheeted out

Is that right or have I mixed it up? (Is there a better way of describing the above?)

Also, what's pumping all about? Is that basically pumping?


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:02 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2003 1:00 am
Posts: 2599
Location: Madison, Wi. Cabrinha, Slingshot, Blade, Axis, Mystic, NP Surf.
Metaphor,

Light wind riding takes tons of practice and there's no one right answer because it really depends on what your current speed and power is at that moment and of course what the wind is doing that you are approaching.

Basically you have it right though for the most part. At the top and bottom of sining, you pull in a little on the bar to make the kite turn as fast as possible, the let the bar out so the kite speeds up when descending and ascending (down and up).

Many people confuse pulling in on the bar with power. In light winds, this is somewhat of a myth in that when you pull in on the bar with modern high depower kites, you can actually make it fly in reverse. So imagine pulling in on the bar when the kite is on the upstroke and it will rise much slower than if you let the bar out and the kite will speed up.

Hope this helps,

Bob
www.kiteridersllc.com


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:20 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2004 2:37 am
Posts: 149
Location: Labia
light wind flying of the kite is more about not sheeting too much in or out.

When flying light wind I also pull in 50/75mm on my depower so it is hard to stall the kite by oversheeting - once this happens you are back to square one.

Kite speed and board speed is your friend, the faster the better so just pinch upwind when you can, and avoid hard edging which will slow the kite down or send it to the window edge and low power.

If you stall, a grab and tug of the front lines can kick it in to flight again , avoid sheeting out too much as you are wasting kite power.

In super light conditions I try to keep the bar at the same sheeting position - the sweet spot that encourages the kite to fly- this sweet spot becomes smaller the lighter the wind. In stronger winds the sweet spot gets greater but avoiding prolonged full sheeting in or out will mean the kite will be flying smoothly and easy to control.

The kite behaves to your control imputs once you dial this in and have the kite flying where you need it all other stuff is much easier.

If you get the kite right then you will land most stuff you try


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 3:53 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2004 11:54 pm
Posts: 589
Location: texas
bob is right. you want to sheet in when turning and the kite will have some snap in the turn but you sheet out when kite is ascending or descending.


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:36 am 
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Joined: Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:13 pm
Posts: 961
Light wind has more to do with the board than the kite. It really takes a lot of practice and lots of walking to learn how to control the board while building your apparent wind. Your on the right path by all ready knowing how sheeting works.


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:30 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2008 8:28 pm
Posts: 120
Location: spain, belgium
TheJoe wrote:
Light wind has more to do with the board than the kite. It really takes a lot of practice and lots of walking to learn how to control the board while building your apparent wind. Your on the right path by all ready knowing how sheeting works.


Indeed it is also my opinion that board is more important as kite. So the right choice of light wind board is what plays the main role. I self already many years ride on Aboards Glider and have forgotten that riding on light wind can be a problem. By the way they just launched model 2014: http://www.kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=2380850


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 12:12 pm
Posts: 1687
Location: Ontario
Light wind flying technique is about maintaining kite speed and/or momentum. You want to max front line tension while back line tension varies. You have basically got it, but don't be too hard and fast with the rules, as its slightly different with different kites. Some pull well through turns, some lose power through turns and generate more in a straight line. Some do better on bottom turns than others and some climb with more power etc... Most kites are tending back toward the "pulls through the turn" style but the extremes are still out there. You don't really sign a flysurfer speed at all, but you work the crap out of C kites. Anyway, its about learning what works best with your kite and getting good at it. You wanna learn how to keep the front line tension high by sheeting in just enough while turning the kite to bank the kites kinetic energy as potential energy and then know when and how much to sheet out as the kite comes out of the turn to again max the kites kinetic energy/speed in the new direction. You gotta do this taking gravity into consideration ie, its harder for a kite to climb than descend. As you go through the sining process you wanna harvest as much energy as you can and convert it to board speed, so, yeah, boards make up a huge portion of the equation. Over sheeting is a show stopper, so as mentioned it becomes very much about working the kite as hard and fast as you can while still being subtle at the bar.


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 8:49 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:27 am
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Location: Ford Lake, Michigan
dont pump the bar in and out all the time, you'll wear a hole in your chicken line in a week -- I did that to one bar I had. Just let the kite breath, let the bar out enough and sine it if u have to.


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 1:44 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2007 1:56 am
Posts: 72
Thanks for the additional details!

I'm thinking of trying kiteloops to maintain better speed as it seems difficult to bring the kite through the upper edge of the wind window in light winds. Good idea? Anything I should be wary of when attempting kiteloops, other than having lots of clear space around, and making sure to have enough clearance to loop the kite? (It's easy on a trainer kite, not sure how it will change on a LEI kite)


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 Post subject: Re: kiting in low wind: timing when sheeting in/out?
PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:33 am 
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Joined: Mon Apr 19, 2004 12:12 pm
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Location: Ontario
Great for getting up on a plane initially, but you cant really maintain it. One, your lines get too wound up and you end up having to loop the other way or let go to spin your bar. Two, I find it almost impossible to go upwind while looping the kite. It heads back to the centre of the window too much where as sining it you can keep it out to one side.


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