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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2013 2:23 pm 
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Mike27 wrote:

What about the low end of the 10m ?.....i don't know if i go for 7-9-12 7-9-11 or 6-8-10 for 80kg......
I don't like big kite,but i want to cover great range of wind....


10m would be too small for you, but 6-8-11 is also an option if you often have wind near 20knots for 8m, and occasional strong winds for 6m. If climate is hot and/or often light wind, 7-9-12 sounds better. You would benefit from a fast board to get apparent wind.


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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 10:37 am 
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@Mike27

After reading this post i tried wakestyle setting on my 2011 vegas 12m2 yesterday. Was quite overpowered and felt the bar to very very light. Actually boosted higher than ever. Didn't unhook very much because of high gusty winds. I must say i like the feel of the kite way better on freeride mode. Changed back to freeride and the bar pressure was heavy how i like, but strangely i didn't jump as high.

Will try on my 9 when the wind will allow it :thumb:


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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 15, 2013 6:31 pm 
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Mike27-
You are correct in your impression. The easy way to think about how your connections affect the bar pressure is to think of a spot between the front connection point and rear connection point as being the center of effort for the kite (I know the engineers are cringing right now... I know I'm not using the correct terms. Please don't yell at me). The closer you move either connection point towards that middle spot (move the front connection back or the back connection forward), the larger a percentage of the load that line will take. So if you move your front connection point back (going from freeride to wakestyle) the front lines will take more of the load so there is less load on the rear lines which obviously means less bar pressure. Similarly, if you move the rear connection point forward (slower turning), it will take more of the load, resulting in higher bar pressure.

So in short to get the lightest possible bar pressure, you should use the rear connection point for both the front and rear attachment points.

On a related note, the further forward you put the front attachment point, the more depower you will get, so when you move the front attachment point back to the wakestyle connection you will get less depower and reactivity out of the kite.

As to the sizing thing, that is completely rider and spot/wind dependent, however if it helps, I have had an 8/10/12 quiver and switched to a 7/9/12. I preferred the 7/9 because I found myself often overpowered on the 8/10... The 2013 Vegas has significantly more lowend than the 2012. At the same time, one of our team guys, Craig, recently went the other way and says he prefers the 10m to the 9m because it's significantly slower turning for a relatively small amount of more power.
And for me, with gorge winds, I very rarely get blown off the 7, whereas the 8m was occasionally just too much. So as I said, it really depends on your local conditions and the type of riding you do.

Hope this helps.

-Dan


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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 21, 2013 11:33 am 
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Dan-at-North wrote:
Mike27-
You are correct in your impression. The easy way to think about how your connections affect the bar pressure is to think of a spot between the front connection point and rear connection point as being the center of effort for the kite (I know the engineers are cringing right now... I know I'm not using the correct terms. Please don't yell at me). The closer you move either connection point towards that middle spot (move the front connection back or the back connection forward), the larger a percentage of the load that line will take. So if you move your front connection point back (going from freeride to wakestyle) the front lines will take more of the load so there is less load on the rear lines which obviously means less bar pressure. Similarly, if you move the rear connection point forward (slower turning), it will take more of the load, resulting in higher bar pressure.

So in short to get the lightest possible bar pressure, you should use the rear connection point for both the front and rear attachment points.

On a related note, the further forward you put the front attachment point, the more depower you will get, so when you move the front attachment point back to the wakestyle connection you will get less depower and reactivity out of the kite.

As to the sizing thing, that is completely rider and spot/wind dependent, however if it helps, I have had an 8/10/12 quiver and switched to a 7/9/12. I preferred the 7/9 because I found myself often overpowered on the 8/10... The 2013 Vegas has significantly more lowend than the 2012. At the same time, one of our team guys, Craig, recently went the other way and says he prefers the 10m to the 9m because it's significantly slower turning for a relatively small amount of more power.
And for me, with gorge winds, I very rarely get blown off the 7, whereas the 8m was occasionally just too much. So as I said, it really depends on your local conditions and the type of riding you do.

Hope this helps.

-Dan



Yes in perfectly understood the difference with the front line setting......but which position give more slack in line ? wakestyle ou freestyle ?

All the size have the same feeling ? because i rode the 9m and the 10m, with the same setting, and i felt that the 10m was as expected, but with a lighter bar pressure than the 9m !?


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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:47 pm 
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In theory I suppose the wakestyle should, but I can't speak to it... I noticed a lot more slack on the 2013 than the 2012, but haven't noticed much difference between the settings, but I'm not landing any airpasses so I'm probably not the guy to ask.

As far as bar pressure, I didn't notice a ton of difference from one size to another. One thing you might be feeling is the positive feedback (especially if you've been flying bridled kites)... 5-line direct-connection kites tend to get more bar pressure the more you sheet in (positive feedback) while bridled kites tend to get less bar pressure the more you sheet in (negative feedback). So if you switch from a 10m to a 9m in the same wind, you will be sheeting in more, so on a "C" kite like the Vegas you will feel more bar pressure, while on a bridled kite you would feel less bar pressure. Make sense?

Other than that, I didn't notice a huge difference in flying characteristics/feeling, other than that the 10m was, obviously, more stable, powerful, and slower turning than the 9m.

-Dan


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 Post subject: Re: Wakestyle or Freeride setting for Vegas 2013 ?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 27, 2013 7:34 pm 
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Dan-at-North wrote:
In theory I suppose the wakestyle should, but I can't speak to it... I noticed a lot more slack on the 2013 than the 2012, but haven't noticed much difference between the settings, but I'm not landing any airpasses so I'm probably not the guy to ask.

As far as bar pressure, I didn't notice a ton of difference from one size to another. One thing you might be feeling is the positive feedback (especially if you've been flying bridled kites)... 5-line direct-connection kites tend to get more bar pressure the more you sheet in (positive feedback) while bridled kites tend to get less bar pressure the more you sheet in (negative feedback). So if you switch from a 10m to a 9m in the same wind, you will be sheeting in more, so on a "C" kite like the Vegas you will feel more bar pressure, while on a bridled kite you would feel less bar pressure. Make sense?

Other than that, I didn't notice a huge difference in flying characteristics/feeling, other than that the 10m was, obviously, more stable, powerful, and slower turning than the 9m.

-Dan


I think you are right.......it did not test the 9m and he 10m the same day but the wind was probably more or less the same.....that explain why the 9m felt harder on bar ! I liked a lot the 10m.....hope if i buy the 9m i won't be disapointed in his wind range !


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