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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 8:17 pm 
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not sure if that was discussed already on the forum...

the German kite mag tested the canopy materials in their latest issue. They tested the 2013 materials (from what I can see on the pics), but afaik most of the brands upgraded it for the 2014 kites... For Core they used the XR3 material (Core Tex).

They took new kites to test, rode them for 6 months and then tested them again. I put the results in the charts attached.

...would have been nice to see how Cabs own material performs, but they didn't test it.


Attachments:
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.40 PM.png
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.40 PM.png [ 16.42 KIB | Viewed 1151 times ]
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.32 PM.png
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.32 PM.png [ 18.32 KIB | Viewed 1151 times ]
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.20 PM.png
Screen Shot 2013-08-22 at 9.11.20 PM.png [ 15.39 KIB | Viewed 1151 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Thu Aug 22, 2013 11:53 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:26 am
Posts: 275
Sure use the light material in a Light wind kites but for anything from 12m down - beef it up to make it last... Who really cares about 2 or 300grams at 20+ knots when your goin hard! Kite design will decide if it turns fast or slow Not an xtra 100grams - otherwise how, for those pathetically weak kiters do you manage to hold a 12 after using 7 ??
There are a few Top brands which "STRUTS" split at the final fold up crease points WTF !!!
Thats obvioisly there weak point but use the bullshit Oh but we use the same materials as others (as long as it lasts the waranty period).
Strange how so much emphasis is placed on Leading edge and canopy strength - BUT - who forgot to engineer the frekn struts for the crease folds that weakn the material faster than any flying does... Ive binned a few kites - because of struts splitting in the same place on both sides. The rest of the kite was in great condition - thats just funked up !!!
So once again KITE DESIGNERS just visit your local kite repair shop and ask which major brands are jokes for the over inflated prices.
Ps Please - make my day and ask me how i fold my kite for very non political reply ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 12:53 am 
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Joined: Sat May 17, 2008 3:44 pm
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Location: DownUnder/Brazil cumbuco-oceanview.com
Kite2Heaven wrote:
Sure use the light material in a Light wind kites but for anything from 12m down - beef it up to make it last... Who really cares about 2 or 300grams at 20+ knots when your goin hard! Kite design will decide if it turns fast or slow Not an xtra 100grams - otherwise how, for those pathetically weak kiters do you manage to hold a 12 after using 7 ??
There are a few Top brands which "STRUTS" split at the final fold up crease points WTF !!!
Thats obvioisly there weak point but use the bullshit Oh but we use the same materials as others (as long as it lasts the waranty period).
Strange how so much emphasis is placed on Leading edge and canopy strength - BUT - who forgot to engineer the frekn struts for the crease folds that weakn the material faster than any flying does... Ive binned a few kites - because of struts splitting in the same place on both sides. The rest of the kite was in great condition - thats just funked up !!!
So once again KITE DESIGNERS just visit your local kite repair shop and ask which major brands are jokes for the over inflated prices.
Ps Please - make my day and ask me how i fold my kite for very non political reply ;)


+1!!! :thumb:
I posted photos of a kite with such strut issues and then there came people accusing me that I abused the struts (and the rest of the kite was in perfect condition). :crazy2:


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 2:06 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 26, 2004 2:37 am
Posts: 148
Location: Labia
edt wrote:
The problem with nylon ripstop and dacron is not strength and wear resistance but that they are too stretchy to use in the entire canopy. If you made a kite out of nylon it would be baggy and drag downwind. It's fine for even major repairs tho.


yes nylon is too stretchy but dacron is polyester-the same stuff as the rest of the kite, just a heavier grade.
fixing kites with nylon works perfectly fine as the inherent stretch lets it give a little, but with less uv resistance will fade over time.

the double and quad core polyester fabrics do seem stronger with higher tenacity, but when the do rip they make a big mess that makes it harder for a nice hidden repair. Typically there will be an area of damage 7-15mm into the fabric along each side of the tear. this has been my experience with the north and best fabrics, and these were new kites too so no wear and tear to speak of.

So the fabric seems heavier and more sturdy, and may give better longevity but damage will be more severe when it happens, and it isn't strong enough to withstand every abuse kiting will dish out.


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 6:15 am 
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Kite2Heaven wrote:
Ps Please - make my day and ask me how i fold my kite for very non political reply ;)


How do you fold your kite then? :)


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:08 pm 
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Location: shallow sea
fdvj wrote:
Cabrinihas cloth is better than Tejin? Really?

cabrinhas cloth IS the teijin. cabrinha just orders the cloth by their specifications from teijin and starts to call this cloth with its own trade mark name.

so does best, so does north, so do the other brands.

teijin is japanese company with the factories all over the world. the cloth for the kites is made in their thailand facilities.
what do you think, how much looms for polyester fiber like this are in the world? my guess less than half a dozen. i think three quarters of them (may be more) work for military and aero-space industry (parachutes for personnel and cargo and breaking parachutes for the aircrafts). the rest are for sport activities (sail boats, hang gliders, hot air balloons, kites etc).

you can order the teijin cloth coated or not coated, double, triple or quad rip-stop, in any colour. it is your money. after that you are free to call it what you want. just remember double RS is heavier than ordinary RS, and triple RS is even more heavier. the difference is how many thicker strands are in the cloth per square inch.

it is only how you arrange the spools with the different thickness of the polyester strands in the loom, that is the whole simple magic!


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Fri Aug 23, 2013 8:32 pm 
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Location: shallow sea
same goes for dacron for the struts and LE. it comes from the factory in germany.

again, order it how you want it to be and name it as you wish


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 9:26 am 
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Location: Labia
eree wrote:
fdvj wrote:
Cabrinihas cloth is better than Tejin? Really?


the difference is how many thicker strands are in the cloth per square inch.

it is only how you arrange the spools with the different thickness of the polyester strands in the loom, that is the whole simple magic!


actually the strands are the same it is just a bundle of fibres woven as one in a series


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 4:36 pm 
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Posts: 750
Anyone use this??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lNYX7L2B-eg


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 Post subject: Re: Canopy Materials
PostPosted: Sat Aug 24, 2013 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 08, 2007 5:12 pm
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Location: CubaKiteLessons.com
Anyone knows where to buy teijin tape in the same thickness as the canopy with 3M adhesive backing. I would like to do repairs with tape only on the inside of the kite so the outside looks original. I have a industrial 3 step 6mm machine so no problem closing the cut with one pass on the outside.


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