*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 72 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 12:15 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:52 am
Posts: 51
Location: Sandy Lane, Barbados
This is exactly what happened. It's strange that the lines would tangle around the wingtip! It's nice to hear i'm not the only person who experienced these things. Thank you for sharing.


dusta wrote:
i started on obsessions and never really knew anything else apart from the flag to both centre lines . I've had mk2 and mk3 obsessions with v2 ,v3 and v4 bars . Even on the beginnner setting it never flagged 100% as claimed in the manual . Kite always stayed powered up . Had many times where the a steerling line tangled around a wingtip or something similar and the kite went into an deathloop even when flagged. RRD has a shit safety system . Glad i switched to ozone's .


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 12:21 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 05, 2011 3:52 am
Posts: 51
Location: Sandy Lane, Barbados
Thank you for your message..... The first time this happened I was with the student and a line broke but would not depower but the second time my student was pretty far out in the water so i'm not 100% sure what exactly happened. I think you are right thought and the leash was connected to the wrong ring. The kite only went 5m when ejected. As far as telling the student to release the safety if "shit hits the fan". I VERY clearly told him that before hand but he told me he didn't do it because he thought he could fix it....... sometimes you just never know what is going through your students head in the moment but hopefully this will never happen again!!

PVITfrumBYRAM wrote:
JessicaWinkler wrote:

The following day my student dropped the 6m Obsession kite and after trying to relaunch it simply started looping with all lines intact. My student ejected almost immediately but the kite did not depower or stop looping. This time the kite continued to loop for about 15 minutes until finally he became very tired and released the whole thing. I recovered the kite and the student with no physical harm done and after closer inspection nothing had broken on the kite or bar.



Jessica, thanks for bringing these experiences up. In the instance of the the kite looping after relaunching, it sound like a bar end float got stuck around the bottom of the bar. Having been using a 6 meter, I'm guessing if was crazy gusty and the kite probably dropped with a little slack of the student maneuvered the kite back to relaunch position maybe catching the float on the bar. This would perhaps cause the kite to keep looping especially if they had the leash on the suicide ring and not the flagging ring. Could you tell from your vantage point if the bar traveled along the mini 5th line?

I fly obsessions and sometimes in lulls when my kite drops, I save it at the last second by pulling the float and then I let go. But I forget and sometimes the float gets caught up on the bar and I go for a ride on a loop or two.

These days when teaching, especially when going over safety systems, I don't just tell my students this is your first release and this is your secondary which lets you ditch the kite if shit hits the fan. Now I say, "If you think shit is hitting the fan, you need to be ready to ditch the kite fast if your primary is not doing its job."

I tend to not trust any system completely, there is always something that could happen and it's up to your decisions and actions to get you out of it.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 12:36 pm 
Offline
Frequent Poster

Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2012 9:09 pm
Posts: 266
longwhitecloud wrote:
"Friend of mine was drowned by a spinning RRD kite after he pulled the safety."

No shit!

What happened - bridle tangle, line bar wrap, pulley jam, leash caught over bar end?


Wasnt there but basically from what I understand he pulled the safety and the bridle got tangled on a wing tip. Went into a violent death spin and got dragged under water hit his head and was knocked out. He is very lucky to be alive, 9 times out of 10 he would have died. He now rides North with a 5th line which in my opinion is the best safety system on the market.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2013 2:29 pm 
Offline
Frequent Poster

Joined: Sat May 22, 2010 3:20 am
Posts: 211
Glad to hear they both didn't get hurt or worse. I've had my steering line wrap the wingtip once. I noticed when I unfolded my kite it was bent outwards. It felt funny at launch so I landed it, right before it was caught by someone I saw the snag. Now I tuck that flap under the LE at the wingtip and haven't had an issue. Sure there have been times my kite hasn't fully flagged, other times it has, and still others thought fast enough to pull my oh shit handle. I've had many issues with Cabrihnas myself when teaching on them. I've seen how effective ozones system is but I still wouldn't operate under the stipulation that the "best" safety system on the market will always work, or something along those lines. Actually had an ozone kite loop right on top of me yesterday, the other riders kite within 2 meters from me. I was already in the water from a crash and luckily I had the forethought to stay under water and have my kite pull me away giving him time to get his kite off my lines and keep his lines from getting snagged on me or my bar. All I'm saying is if you sit back and relax assuming your system with kick in, at some point down the road it won't. Your thought process experience and action is your best safety system, now Jessica's students might have a better understanding of that, and a better understanding that their lives are worth more than trying to save their $1200 in equipment.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:10 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2005 1:17 am
Posts: 2171
Location: Save a life...adopt a Pitbull
PVITfrumBYRAM wrote:
I fly obsessions and sometimes in lulls when my kite drops, I save it at the last second by pulling the float and then I let go. But I forget and sometimes the float gets caught up on the bar and I go for a ride on a loop or two.
Your kite should not be dropping out of the sky on you. This is another problem with the Obsession.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:21 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 4:49 am
Posts: 3614
Location: Japan
JessicaWinkler wrote:
It's strange that the lines would tangle around the wingtip!

IMHO that is a character flaw with delta kites... see it all the time.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:46 am 
Offline
Medium Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jul 08, 2008 10:25 pm
Posts: 184
Hi. I use kites of all brands and among them RRD kites (Obsession, Addiction and Religion). Everytime I fly for the first time a new kite I check the QR on the beach (in this case bar V4 and V5). All seemed to work properly but when things go really wrong is a totally different matter; the death loop traction is something very hard to deal with and I've experienced myself a crazy situation like that with a Cabrinha kite (broken line...). In that case I released first the QR and after that I pulled the second security on the harness loop, letting the kite go (I was alone in the water...). All worked fine and later I was able to recover the kite (Cab Switchblade 2011). This system with a double security (four lines..) and others with the fifth line seem to be the best. Back to RRD kites I've never pulled the security in a dangerous situation and what has been reported in this topic scares me like hell because with the Religion 6 I've had some wave sessions in big waves and 34/40 Knots :o ! Noticed that during a wave session I always connect the QR leash near the harness hook so I can let the kite go......but in this case seems not enough! Said that I hope RRD distributors or athlets add to this discussion some important contributions and advices. Safety first: going out with a QR that doesn't work in a emergency situation looks like playing the russian roulette!
Cheers
Carlo


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 10:26 am 
Offline
Rare Poster

Joined: Tue Dec 18, 2012 10:11 am
Posts: 49
Location: Australia
JessicaWinkler wrote:
Thank you for your message..... The first time this happened I was with the student and a line broke but would not depower but the second time my student was pretty far out in the water so i'm not 100% sure what exactly happened. I think you are right thought and the leash was connected to the wrong ring. The kite only went 5m when ejected. As far as telling the student to release the safety if "shit hits the fan". I VERY clearly told him that before hand but he told me he didn't do it because he thought he could fix it....... sometimes you just never know what is going through your students head in the moment but hopefully this will never happen again!!

PVITfrumBYRAM wrote:
JessicaWinkler wrote:

The following day my student dropped the 6m Obsession kite and after trying to relaunch it simply started looping with all lines intact. My student ejected almost immediately but the kite did not depower or stop looping. This time the kite continued to loop for about 15 minutes until finally he became very tired and released the whole thing. I recovered the kite and the student with no physical harm done and after closer inspection nothing had broken on the kite or bar.



Jessica, thanks for bringing these experiences up. In the instance of the the kite looping after relaunching, it sound like a bar end float got stuck around the bottom of the bar. Having been using a 6 meter, I'm guessing if was crazy gusty and the kite probably dropped with a little slack of the student maneuvered the kite back to relaunch position maybe catching the float on the bar. This would perhaps cause the kite to keep looping especially if they had the leash on the suicide ring and not the flagging ring. Could you tell from your vantage point if the bar traveled along the mini 5th line?

I fly obsessions and sometimes in lulls when my kite drops, I save it at the last second by pulling the float and then I let go. But I forget and sometimes the float gets caught up on the bar and I go for a ride on a loop or two.

These days when teaching, especially when going over safety systems, I don't just tell my students this is your first release and this is your secondary which lets you ditch the kite if shit hits the fan. Now I say, "If you think shit is hitting the fan, you need to be ready to ditch the kite fast if your primary is not doing its job."

I tend to not trust any system completely, there is always something that could happen and it's up to your decisions and actions to get you out of it.



What is "the wrong ring?"


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:11 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 9:22 pm
Posts: 99
Hi all. I have many years experience on all the RRD Obsessions and have got myself in serious trouble only once (2009 bridal snapped and looping kite). Few things to clarify:

1. RRD safety release is the "o'shit handle" on the outside of the bar not the centre line release. There are 2 centre steel rings. The one with the red plastic toggle pulls the centre line through the bar the other steel ring is for unhooked "suicide" riding. If you leash on this ring you will get pulled and looped a bit.

2. The centre line release can be used up to mid range winds but will pull a fair bit when released. If you go out in 40mph winds clip to the "o'shit handle" ....or you take your chances...

3. The 2012 RRD Obsession is a little UNSTABLE for sure, but very minor. It is a trade off, the kite was made higer aspect ratio from 2011 to 2012. If you ping it fast behind you it will drop on slack lines and either hit the water or suddenly power up. Not a great feature but you can deal with it if your aware of this.

4. The 2009 and 2010 RRD global bars were set up on a single front line flag out release this changed in 2011. The single line is touted by many as the only safe method. I got in real trouble with this single line safety on a 2009 bar when the bridal insert wore through and the kite death looped

5. AS SOON as somehting goes wrong pull the safety release. If a kite carries on looping then pull your leash pin.

I am suprised to see RRD 2012 global bar onwards with NO "o'shit handles"... this is a potentially dangerous bar in my opinion. If you have one then maybe rig up a front line flag out by running some line through the centre hole and using steel hoops.


Last edited by BillyGoatGruff on Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:48 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: RRD safety system fail
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 4:21 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Wed Mar 15, 2006 9:22 pm
Posts: 99
p.s something else important which is over looked:

NEVER clip your leash to the steel ring on the back of a harness unless your landing back mobes in fairly light winds. So many people clip to this. Leash a kite in 35mph winds and you will be torpedoed backwards with almost no chance to hit the leash pin. Conect the leash to a front part of your harness, then you have a chance.


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 72 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: AdrenalinDriven, cabsb, Google [Bot], Google Feedfetcher, JS, knotwindy, KVL, magic%20Ed, UKRob, Yahoo [Bot] and 16 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group