*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 30 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Waroo 20 vs Flysurfer Silver Arrow 17
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 5:54 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:53 am
Posts: 1102
Some readers have expressed interest in this comparison. I own both kites. I bought them with my own money and I am not sponsored by anyone. I weigh 180 LBS and I have been kiting for 6 years on the snow and water. I have owned a lot of big kites over the years (Naish 17.5, 21.5, 23.5 ARX, Wipika 16.4 Airblast, Flysurfer 16M MastAir, 17M Psycho, 18.5 Titan, 21.5 & 26M P2, Gaastra Phoenix 25M, Naish V4 30M). I am not biased towards LEI's or foils. I like kites that work well in a variety of conditions.

This is an initial review. I have flown the Waroo 20M 3 times and the Silver Arrow 6-7 times.

Today, I flew the kites back to back. The wind was light (12 - 14mph) with gusts of 15 - 18 mph. I rode on a 149 SS Glide.

These kites are very different, but they are both well-engineered and each has some interesting characteristics. The Silver Arrow is a special edition of the Flysurfer 17M Speed. The difference is the fabric that is used is much lighter in weight. A Speed 17M kite including the bar, lines and kite weighs 4.2 kg compared to 2.7 kg for the Silver Arrow.

Launching/Landing - the Silver Arrow has the advantage as all I had to do was weight down the trailing edge, unwind the lines, and straighten the bridles. From previous experience, I found that the kite requires no pre-inflation in wind over 10 mph. The Waroo was also pretty easy to setup and launch. Landing is another story, the Waroo was a piece of cake to land, while the Silver Arrow still generated a lot of power with the blue safety line pulled. Flysurfer needs to come up with a better system for this kite.

Turning - the Waroo turns faster and since it has a shorter length it is better for kiteloops. Downloops have to be initiated high in the sky with the Silver Arrow if you don't want to drag the tip of the kite in the water.

Power - the Silver Arrow generates more static pull, but it is more of a park and ride type of kite while the Waroo turns fast enough that it can be sined in light wind to generate speed. I think the Silver Arrow would get you going in a knot or two less wind than the Waroo and it generates more power once the wind comes up. Both kites go upwind very well.

Jumping - both kites jump well. The Silver Arrow is more interesting because the jumps are more floaty. On a good jump, you sometimes feel like you are just hanging in the air. I have had this experience with the large Flysurfers on the snow as well. Maybe PMU can explain it ? :wink:

Range - I have not tested either. However, based on my experience with a 16M Waroo, I am almost certain that the 20M Waroo has more top-end.

Gusty conditions - The Waroos are excellent in very gusty conditions. I did notice that the Silver Arrow handles remarkably well in the gusts due to the lightweight fabric. Rather, than folding or falling the kite seems to just hand there. Another advantage of using lightweight material. Makes me think that all sizes of foils would benefit from using a lightweight material, especially for use on the snow as mountain winds are less consistent and variable compared to wind over water.

Price - The Silver Arrow is around double the price of a Waroo.

Which kite should you buy? If I were only using the kite on the water, I would consider a Speed 17. You can pick up a used Speed 17 for a little bit less than a 20M Waroo. If you are looking for a kite for both snow and water, the Silver Arrow is very enticing. Overall, I personally prefer the Silver Arrow, but it is a close call and I may change my mind once I have had an opportunity to fly both kites more extensively.


{ SHARE_ON_FACEBOOK } { SHARE_ON_TWITTER } { SHARE_ON_ORKUT } { SHARE_ON_DIGG } { SHARE_ON_MYSPACE } { SHARE_ON_DELICIOUS }
Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:17 am 
Offline
Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri May 09, 2003 2:50 am
Posts: 206
A great review... thanks very much. I also have a P2 26. It has monster power, but is like driving a truck with no power steering. I would imagine that the silver arrow is a much better experience.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Waroo 20 vs Flysurfer Silver Arrow 17
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 9:47 am 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Wed Apr 17, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 115
fernmanus wrote:

Which kite should you buy? If I were only using the kite on the water, I would consider a Speed 17. You can pick up a used Speed 17 for a little bit less than a 20M Waroo. If you are looking for a kite for both snow and water, the Silver Arrow is very enticing. Overall, I personally prefer the Silver Arrow, but it is a close call and I may change my mind once I have had an opportunity to fly both kites more extensively.


speed17 for water, silver arrow for land&water? will you sell me your waroo or the v4, please?


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:04 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 5:22 am
Posts: 134
Have you flown the regular Speed 17 as well? I'm wondering if there is a difference in turning speed -- I would assume that the lighter weight would result in somewhat quicker turning.

I have a Silver Arrow on order, but it could take a few months, so I'm debating going with the regular Speed 17. I live on an inland lake with no beach areas, so I need a drift-launch capable kite plus something that will stay in the air in the lulls, so the SA or Speed17 seems like pretty much the only choice today.

Also note that the Flysurfer Pulse has the new Full Depower Safety, and there will be a retrofit kit out soon for the Speed. Instead of the current safety, it adds a fifth line that literally folds the kite in half when on safety and has essentially no pull, and very easy relaunch, at least on the Pulse.

Seth


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:38 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:53 am
Posts: 1102
Quote:
Have you flown the regular Speed 17 as well? I'm wondering if there is a difference in turning speed -- I would assume that the lighter weight would result in somewhat quicker turning.

I have a Silver Arrow on order, but it could take a few months, so I'm debating going with the regular Speed 17. I live on an inland lake with no beach areas, so I need a drift-launch capable kite plus something that will stay in the air in the lulls, so the SA or Speed17 seems like pretty much the only choice today.

Also note that the Flysurfer Pulse has the new Full Depower Safety, and there will be a retrofit kit out soon for the Speed. Instead of the current safety, it adds a fifth line that literally folds the kite in half when on safety and has essentially no pull, and very easy relaunch, at least on the Pulse.


Seth, you could buy a used Speed 17 for around $1000 and sell it once you received the Silver Arrow. The Flysurfers seem to retain their value better than most other brands. Sorry, but I have never flown a regular Speed 17. Flysurfer needs to put together a quiver of demo kites for the US. Right now, it seems like if you want to try, you have to buy. I think the user Daft on Foilzone has tried both the Speed 17 and Silver Arrow. You might try sending him a PM.

I will buy the Full Depower Safety once it is available. In the meantime, I am going to install a mod so I can flagout the kite. I haven't tried the drift launch yet, but I would think that the Silver Arrow would work better than the standard Speed because it inflates so easily.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:40 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:53 am
Posts: 1102
Quote:
speed17 for water, silver arrow for land&water? will you sell me your waroo or the v4, please?


I had the same thought last night. I don't think I need all 3. I am thinking of selling the Waroo.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:42 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:53 am
Posts: 1102
Quote:
A great review... thanks very much. I also have a P2 26. It has monster power, but is like driving a truck with no power steering. I would imagine that the silver arrow is a much better experience.




Thanks. The P2 26M does feel like a truck at times. The Silver Arrow feels much more nimble, but it still gives you awesome float in the air.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:42 pm 
Offline
Medium Poster

Joined: Wed Oct 12, 2005 5:22 am
Posts: 134
Thanks for the info. Any suggestions on where to look for a used Speed 17? I think that's a great idea -- I can probably sell it for about what I paid, so it will be "rental" until the SA arrives.

Which mod are you doing to flag it out? The o-shit handles?

Seth


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:44 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 557
Location: Crystal Palace
Seth - try Tone on Foilzone - he may have a 17 going


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Jun 01, 2006 1:49 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 23, 2004 5:53 am
Posts: 1102
Two more areas that I thought of last night after writing the review:

Travel - the Silver Arrow wins hands down as it packs down much smaller. It packs down as small as my 8M Aero. The Waroo 20 is about the same size packed down as any other 20M LEI

Bar Setup - The chicken loop travel on the Waroo 20M is too long. I bought a stopper that is similar to the style used on the SS Turbodiesel, but I haven't installed it yet. A local rider that lives here and is sponsored by Best shortened the length of his chicken loop, but I understand that by doing so, you eliminate the amount of depower avaialable. I did like riding with his bar much better than my current stock bar. I liked the range of travel on the FS bar, the only thing lacking is the ability to flag out or fully depower the kite as I mentioned in my previous post.


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 30 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], Google Feedfetcher, jjm, ktouhey, Majestic-12 [Bot], MSNbot Media, ORSales and 24 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group