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 Post subject: 2008 Best Nemesis HP 9m First Impressions
PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 7:01 pm 
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Posts: 2757
Location: Portland, Oregon
Conditions: 15mph-30mph, chop and flat water
Location: Gorge
Ability: Intermediate/Advanced
Other kites flown this year: 2007 Waroos (owned quiver), 2007 Yarga 9m (owned), 2007 Bullaros, 2007 Boxers, 2007 Fuel 11m, 2007 Crossbow 9m, 2007 T2s, 2007 SS Links, 2008 SS REVs (own quiver), 2008 Naish Helix 9m, 2008 LF Havocs

Pros
- Very stable
- Very good jumper, excellent hangtime
- Stiff LE
- Good relaunch
- Steady pull
- Good depower
- Fast forward flying, nearly impossible back stall

Cons
- Heavy bar feel
- Not the fastest turner
- Complex front bridle

Got a chance to ride the new Nemi for an hour or so in 15-30mph winds. Only had the one sesh so I'd call this more first impressions than a review.

First thing I noticed is how much pressure we put in the leading edge, about 10 pounds. The LE is incredibly thin but very stiff when pumped up this hard. The cuben fiber can hold it though and it makes for a very solid kite. The front line pulley setup is very unique, 3 pulleys all within about a foot of each other.

In the air the kite is very stable and well mannered. The kite didn't have a tendency to overfly or back stall, it was very happy flying above me in very gusty wind.

The bar pressure to sheet the kite was relatively light, but steering required a bit more pressure than I really liked. I hear from Best there are a number of back line settings and I am not sure which one I was on at the time, I don't think the dealer had messed with these settings at all so it must be the factory setting. It'd be nice to get close to the 06 Waroo for bar pressure, that kite had a very nice bar pressure for wave riding that I don't think has been duplicated since. The Yarga also has a very nice bar feel, a bit more pressure but very responsive feeling.

Turning speed was average, putting a lot of pressure on the bar you could get the kite to loop pretty good but not as easy as the Yarga SLE or Rev. I can see in the Nemi demo video the best guys have gotten the kite to loop well but perhaps this is bigger guys with more leverage on the kite. There's also two types of loops, one where you pull the loop right from the water and another where you boost then loop the kite. The former is a bit more extreme and easier to pull on the Yarga or the Rev.

But the kite doesn't really need to be moved that much, it seems to be very happy trucking along at a static position, building speed and thus power. It had a very steady boat like pull to it. In the winds I was in I would expect at times to be overpowered but the kite was very smooth and didn't overpower me much at all. I could see this kite setting some speed records.

Jumping was very nice, every jump felt like it had a little extra hang in it than I was used to. Maybe unrelated but I got a weird lightheaded feeling after a few jumps, not sure what that was, perhaps the velocity and hang was going to my head! I would say if this kite has one standout attribute its jumping.

Testing the relaunch was hard at first because I couldn't get the damn thing to stick to the water. Its so stiff that it wants to open up and fly as soon as you crash it. Finally I got it LE down in front of me and pulled a sideline. The kite didn't quite have the magic flip over and go feel of a Helix or Rev, but it did relaunch very easy. The tips seemed to rest out of the water when it was LE down, so I think this helps it flip easier. I'd have to try it in very lightwind to see how easy it really relaunches.

Pulled the depower all the way and tried to put the kite in some situations where it might flatten or partially invert. The Nemesis was very well behaved though and stayed solid the whole time. Another thing I tried was to get it to backstall, this was almost impossible. Its actually amazing how much the kite just wants to fly forward.

Summary
This is a good kite. For solidness and stability I'd say its as good or better than the Helix, which previously I thought was the most stable (at least in high winds.) The turning speed is average, the Rev is a much faster looper some might say too fast. To land handle passes sometimes a bit less speed is better. The kite has a pretty direct feel but too much bar pressure IMO and sort of a heavy feel, again I might need to try different backline settings to really dial this in. Its nice that Best gives you the option of customizing the feel of the kite.

People who like to boost will like this kite, its very good at boosting and hangs for a long time. Since the original cuben fiber kites from Best hangtime has always been the standout advantage to me.

Big air riders, wakestyle freestyle, this could be your kite... For wave riding and kiteloop focused riders maybe wait for other offerings from Best.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:46 pm 
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Dax, what rear line setting did you have it on?

For faster turning try sticking both parts of the V onto the rear most attachment, thats the A-A settting.

details attached.


Attachments:
Nemesis_HP_-Custom_Tune_A-B.jpg
Nemesis_HP_-Custom_Tune_A-B.jpg [ 172.2 KIB | Viewed 3754 times ]
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Sep 23, 2007 9:55 pm 
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Location: Brazil / Florida
Nice review Dax. It sounds like you flew the kite on the AB or AC rear bridle setting. You personally will like the AA setting much more. Light and fast like the 06 Waroo - it's amazing what one little 3 second knot change will do to the speed, bar input for turning, and overall bar pressure. I prefer the AC setting on the 9m Nemesis HP as AA and AB are just too fast for me. I like AB on the 10m and 12m and AA on the 14m. The 7m I ride BC. Plus, with these settings, I can jump from the 9m to the 14m if the wind dies and the kites fly and feel very similar.

The other day, we rode the 9m Rev and the 9m Helix back to back with the 08 Waroo and the 08 Nemesis HP. On the AA setting, the 9m Waroo was the fastest and lightest, then the Rev and the HP about similar, the Helix slower. As for feel, the Nemi wins hands down, it feels much more stable and ridgid in the air compared to these three kites or any Dacron LE kite. Jumping goes hands down to the Nemi, then the Waroo and Rev were similar with the Helix being noticibly lower with less hangtime than the rest.

Then, there's pricing... The HP is about $300-370 less than the Helix and the Rev depending on if you compare the standard inflation Nemesis or the optional EZ Pump version. Then the Waroo is significantly less than the Nemesis HP, and even though we haven't released pricing yet, let's just say it's VERY similar to the 2007 pricing... :D


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 5:59 am 
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Good stuff guys, I will have to try the AA setting. Its really a nice feature that you let people choose for their style. I know people who really like more bar pressure so they don't accidentally redirect the kite or something.

There was another Nemi HP out today, a 10m on the AB setting. Lots of guys getting rides and all very happy with its stability and depower. One guy is a few pounds lighter than me and didn't look like he was having too much trouble holding it down when I was real lit on my 9m.

I will try the AA setting for sure, but it'd also be interesting to try the new Waroo, from what Alex is saying it'd be closer to the Rev in feel which is more my style these days. It'd also be nice to try the 7m, saw some incredible loops today on a Rev 7m I'd like to see how the new Nemi / Waroo match up.

Cheers :thumb:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 12:37 pm 
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Hi Dax, interesting review! Could you compare it to the 2008 LF Havoc, please. Is it right that your prefered kite is new Rev? Why?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 5:12 pm 
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There are some pretty insane loops in the Nemesis HP Promo Video, and those are mostly on 10m kites in low 20's wind... Looping the 7m Nemesis HP in 35+ knots is radical! You won't find a kite that goes bigger this year.

Dax, you won a free quiver of Rev's, yes?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 5:23 pm 
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Quote:
Dax, you won a free quiver of Rev's, yes?


Not sure what that has to do with anything but if you consider free as kiting for 7hrs straight (He kited over 100 miles in one day :o ) then yes he did.

Send some Waroo's and Nemi's out here to the Gorge so we can demo them cant wait to try the new Waroo.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 6:16 pm 
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gumball wrote:
There are some pretty insane loops in the Nemesis HP Promo Video, and those are mostly on 10m kites in low 20's wind... Looping the 7m Nemesis HP in 35+ knots is radical! You won't find a kite that goes bigger this year.

Dax, you won a free quiver of Rev's, yes?


I won 2 kites in the KB4C race last month, but I had bought a 7m a couple weeks previous.

http://www.gokiting.com/wordpress/?p=35

I'll be honest I have had the opportunity to fly the Rev protos for awhile before they were out and have been salivating for the release. I actually borrowed a 9m Rev for the KB4C race I liked it so much. They are nice kites, better for my style than any other kite available at the time IMO.

However I have been a big fan of Best kites since the first ones, they've always been a great value and better than average kites. Maybe the new Best kites could make me switch back? And its not just about what I want, I have quite a few friends here who used to fly Slingshot and now fly Best (your welcome) and are interested in the new kites so I try to be as honest to the true attributes of the kite as possible. I also have a number of friends that came from Best this year and bought the Rev.

I haven't flown a single kite this year from any brand that was absolutely all singing all dancing best of everything, I don't think that kite exists! Equipment always seems to have its trade-offs. For instance I would say I prefer the Rev bar because it has the front line safety system, but it also has a terribly hard to use depower adjustment system. The Havoc is an awesome unhooked kite and jumps sweet, very clean and easy bar, but doesn't appeal to the kitelooper in me. The Helix is stable and fairly easy to ride, but has powerless turns, poor low end, and isn't that great of a jumper.

The Nemi is a sweet kite but is it the best BEST kite this year for my style? I don't know I'd like to try that 08 Waroo before I'd say so. Last year I didn't like the Waroo Pro, I liked the Waroo, but I really wished I waited for the Bullaroo... Much more my style. The Yarga SLE was also a real fun kite, and loops awesome. Then there was the Waroo 06, that could be the best wave kite ever made... There are still guys here trying to to ride them as long as possible. They've tried the new offerings and they don't like them as much.

As for the loops in the vid, yes well done Alex, you guys did an excellent job and are killing it. But you're also all pretty much pros riding in perfect conditions. I want to know its stuff I can do too, in chop and gusty crappy gorge wind. So I rely on what I can see and experience myself at my own spots as a judgement. So I can't wait to see the 7m! :D

But really if you are looking for a new kite and you read all this you are tech-ing out way too much and you just need to ride. Do as many demos as you can make a deceision and then just go kite. I'd probably ride my first kite (a Naish 10m Aero) if I got twice as many sessions a year. :thumb:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 10:04 pm 
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Alex, a Pro? that's quite a compliment...

Knowing how and where you ride i think the Waroo will be the kite you are looking for. it's just that little bit easier and detuned enough to make everything super simple.. and the lower AR helps with everything but boosting and hangtime.

we'll get one out there real soon.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2007 10:13 pm 
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sq225917 wrote:
the lower AR helps with everything but boosting and hangtime.


So, which kite is better at going upwind? The Waroo or the HP. I would think that the thin LE of the HP would give it a distinct advantage over the Waroo. Is that correct or no?


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