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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Fri Jun 14, 2013 11:04 pm 
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My opinion: It's an impressive, well executed project, but probably not easily adaptable to a great commercial venture in it's present form.

With several generations of refinement and simplification, I can see this concept evolving into a faster, more versatile, safer craft... ending up with what's currently recognized as a race board. If you look at the timeline of the branch of performance sailboats that evolved into sailboards and then kiteboards, this craft looks like it belongs somewhere in the middle of that evolution, not at the end, or beyond it.

Therefore, also considering that sit-ski type boards are already fairly well suited to paraplegic kiteboarding, I think the best direction for your concept is not to compete with inherently simpler, faster alternatives like race boards, but rather to create a safer, albeit lower performance alternative that allows more than one person to ride together, with minimal training. In other words, a simple kite boat... which might also act as a stepping stone for those who wish to advance to kiteboarding.

Cheers,
James


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 2:01 am 
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JS wrote:
, but rather to create a safer, albeit lower performance alternative that allows more than one person to ride together, with minimal training. In other words, a simple kite boat... which might also act as a stepping stone for those who wish to advance to kiteboarding.

Cheers,
James


I have been experimenting a bit with sailing a mast-less catamaran with a kite. Flying a kite from a catamaran is a great training tool to get used to the kit without as much of the beat down beginners get when starting out. It is also a great way for almost anyone to have a big kite experience even if they never intend to kite board.


I am interested to see if and how this kite scooter idea evolves


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 4:25 am 
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Has anyone else noticed, it looks like he's riding a big red penis :o ? Just sayin'.

This might be a big seller in San Fransisco, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 7:17 am 
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Hi, is this like the sail rocket where the front foil is actually generating downward force counter to the kite?

Pretty freaking cool. Are you the same guy that started out with a kayak hull? I remember seeing that and thinking it needed a planing hull instead of displacement.

Is it possible to add a self-adjusting hydrofoil the the board to smooth out the ride and further reduce wetted surface?


Trent


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 11:27 am 
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jrfiol wrote:
Does the metal ring affect the steering of the kite?


I have experienced rarely, in very light winds, that the back lines got stuck between ring and front lines, but could resolve the issue by a single hitch on the bar. From 8knts onwards no difference in steering than without ring, I haven't tried anything else than the speed 3 though, so no idea about other kites (but the less bar pressure, the more likely to get problems).


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 12:03 pm 
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frankm1960 wrote:
kibokit wrote:
So give me one good reason why that's a good idea and I'll shut up :)



Reason Nr1 (more on request): It is fun to ride rather effortlessly at 20+ knts speed in 10- knts of wind, without even having to train a lot.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 12:53 pm 
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JS wrote:
. . . not to compete with inherently simpler, faster alternatives like race boards, but rather to create a safer, albeit lower performance alternative that allows more than one person to ride together, with minimal training. In other words, a simple kite boat... which might also act as a stepping stone for those who wish to advance to kiteboarding.

Cheers,
James


I actually had yachts and dinghies in mind, when I first invented this rigging system, and build dinghy-based prototypes as well

[youtube]http://youtu.be/ruBQ1CM_VUA[/youtube]

while I had lot's of fun building and operating them, the slightly to effortful launch and recovery procedure for the kite prevented me from even trying to commercialize the concept.
After having downsized it to a beach launch-able size I see much better chances, to turn this into a marketable product.
I haven't tried yet, but could most probably carry a passenger on the kite scooter prototype.
I am optimistic, that after some not too big amount of R&D this could be even faster than race boards (reasoning: +++no heeling moment allows for bigger kite size in same wind, ++more effective foils, --slightly more weight, --slightly more wetted area, )
The kite scooter, even my prototype, could be used as a stepping stone for kiteboarding, after having learned to safely control the kite one could immediately start riding and going upwind at ease.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 1:08 pm 
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HAMLINDP wrote:
Has anyone else noticed, it looks like he's riding a big red penis :o ? Just sayin'.

This might be a big seller in San Fransisco, right?


This design feature was absolutely not intended, but I had already recognized.
As phallus symbols have proven to sell well, this probably should be further developed, could greatly increase market chances everywhere, not only in SF


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 1:29 pm 
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not annonymous wrote:
Hi, is this like the sail rocket where the front foil is actually generating downward force counter to the kite?

Pretty freaking cool. Are you the same guy that started out with a kayak hull? I remember seeing that and thinking it needed a planing hull instead of displacement.

Is it possible to add a self-adjusting hydrofoil the the board to smooth out the ride and further reduce wetted surface?


Trent


Front foil indeed generates some down force as in the Sailrocket, dependent on the angle the kite is flown at (the higher the kite, the more down force)
I had last year tried out the rig on a kayak (and presented a video of it in this forum, http://youtu.be/kjUEq6yhX-s).
I had thought about lifting hydrofoils as well, but I suppose that the small planing area at the stern is not far enough behind in terms of wetted area to justify the additional effort. Riding comfort was also absolutely great (though in yet comparatively low speeds of up to 13knts), probably due to the fact that the sitting position is between kite lifted bow and planing stern section.

Ingo


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 3:13 pm 
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Very nice work and it does look like good fun. However, I think it is unlikely that any reputable manufacturer will get involved until you find a way to protect the rider from impact with the trailing edge of the foil.


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