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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 3:37 pm 
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Location: Vancouver
kibokit wrote:
I am optimistic, that after some not too big amount of R&D this could be even faster than race boards (reasoning: +++no heeling moment allows for bigger kite size in same wind...)

Race board design is getting pretty efficient, but I agree you have an advantage with your foil's more "aligned" approach to opposing lateral and vertical kite forces, thereby reducing heeling moment and even a theoretical limit on kite size. With well sorted foil alignment and stabilization...extraordinary performance potential.

I still believe commercial success will be challenging though, and more attainable if your design allows two or more riders. Quite a thrill for a non-kiteboarder or even non-sailor to have a ride.

Cheers,
James


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2013 8:23 pm 
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Ask Peter Lynn how well his Kitecat sold for $6,000.

http://www.dakitez.com/peter-lynn-kitecat/

http://www.lynnkitesailing.co.nz/


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 5:01 am 
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Location: Miami @ 6" Flat Butter!
kibokit wrote:
I am going to try to convince some bigger companies, preferably kite board manufacturers, to bring this to market. No idea, however, how long this is going to take, but certainly a while.
Nice to see when somebody is thinking out of the box :thumb:
I would show it to Flysurfer since you fly that also :idea:
Since this a specialized area, why don't you just sell it as custom based until it catches up :?:
Just one question since you put a lot of thought in it;
Appears to be the hydrofoil part on the front is symmetrical
and most of the time only half section is used below water level on the video.
So what would happen to eliminate the upper half of it, above the water level
and somehow with a trick using the same half for the other tack, just thinking :?:

DrLW


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 9:05 am 
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DrLightWind wrote:
kibokit wrote:
I am going to try to convince some bigger companies, preferably kite board manufacturers, to bring this to market. No idea, however, how long this is going to take, but certainly a while.
Nice to see when somebody is thinking out of the box :thumb:
I would show it to Flysurfer since you fly that also :idea:
Since this a specialized area, why don't you just sell it as custom based until it catches up :?:
Just one question since you put a lot of thought in it;
Appears to be the hydrofoil part on the front is symmetrical
and most of the time only half section is used below water level on the video.
So what would happen to eliminate the upper half of it, above the water level
and somehow with a trick using the same half for the other tack, just thinking :?:

DrLW


Maybe with a short mast that passed through a ball type mounting on the board? There would be only one foil and the mast would only need to be tall enough above the board to pull the foil into roughly the right position before the foil started to develop downward/sideways pull.

I've written about something similar before, but in combination with the hull being a wing shape and using Wing-In-Ground-effect (WIG).



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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 11:53 pm 
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bobber wrote:
Very nice work and it does look like good fun. However, I think it is unlikely that any reputable manufacturer will get involved until you find a way to protect the rider from impact with the trailing edge of the foil.


Since impact would be from the rider going forward but operational pressure is only from front to back, maybe a hinge effect would work, allowing it to bend forward when hit from behind (by a rider).

I think the main marketability would be from the ability to carry one or more passengers. This increases usability into a completely unexploited market. Perhaps some type of inflatable technology could keep the weight down.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 4:05 am 
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RichardM wrote:
bobber wrote:
Very nice work and it does look like good fun. However, I think it is unlikely that any reputable manufacturer will get involved until you find a way to protect the rider from impact with the trailing edge of the foil.


Since impact would be from the rider going forward but operational pressure is only from front to back, maybe a hinge effect would work, allowing it to bend forward when hit from behind (by a rider).

I think the main marketability would be from the ability to carry one or more passengers. This increases usability into a completely unexploited market. Perhaps some type of inflatable technology could keep the weight down.


The unit consisting of the two hydrofoils and the double lever arm is connected to the pivot by only two small nut bolts placed very close to each other. These act as predetermined breaking points and will protect the bottom foil if hitting the ground (by shearing off and releasing the unit) and (hopefully) the rider, if he is to hit the foil after a nosedive.
For the grounding part it has already proven to work flawlessly a couple of times (involuntarily, while launching through the surf) for the nosediving part I fortunately haven't had to try it out yet.
Definitely, as mentioned before, the trailing edge has to be made from rubber or the like, as it would on impact act as an awful weapon otherwise.

Ingo.


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:17 am 
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Location: New Zealand - owner of HellBoardriders.com
Great to see your project still going forward. I've been watching it for some time.
I think the best direction forward is as a repower system.
So add it to Kayaks, SUPs Boats Cats etc as a hardware accs unit.

Forget the scooter... but who am I do tell Stephen Hawkins what to do ;) :thumb:

Great work man!


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 5:38 am 
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Joined: Thu May 24, 2012 6:11 am
Posts: 22
DrLightWind wrote:
kibokit wrote:
I am going to try to convince some bigger companies, preferably kite board manufacturers, to bring this to market. No idea, however, how long this is going to take, but certainly a while.
Nice to see when somebody is thinking out of the box :thumb:
I would show it to Flysurfer since you fly that also :idea:
Since this a specialized area, why don't you just sell it as custom based until it catches up :?:
Just one question since you put a lot of thought in it;
Appears to be the hydrofoil part on the front is symmetrical
and most of the time only half section is used below water level on the video.
So what would happen to eliminate the upper half of it, above the water level
and somehow with a trick using the same half for the other tack, just thinking :?:

DrLW


Foils are asymmetrical parallel Hydrofoils H105, made by Australian moth builder Fastacraft. It indeed is a little longer than necessary, but I had to take what was best matching my requirements and the extra length made the mounting part easier for me.

Ingo


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 10:51 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:33 pm
Posts: 111
I like the idea of a non heeling design definitely the holy grail of speed sailing. The foils at the front seem dangerous even with a rubber trailing edge.

The hull seems a bit big to me, is that out of a flotation concern for when/if the wind or kite drops?

Looks like it is good fun on the water :)


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 Post subject: Re: Kite scooter could outpace raceboards: Prototype video
PostPosted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 11:23 am 
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Posts: 1408
I think it is a great idea for a fun project. I don't think it is viable as a product though.

Maybe for people with movement disabilities?

To be more efficient than a large kite on a raceboard is still a WAAAY off for you.

I can ride 3x the wind speed on my 15m and race board - The good guys are going WAAY faster than me too.

fun idea

Not viable.

Tony :)


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