Dimitri M wrote:You are welcome OceanAdventures. I am sure few people are wondering if it was blowing 10 knots then why in some of the footages you hear so much wind!!! Well very simple. NOISE REDUCTION. WHEN FILMING OUTDOORS, MAKE SURE TO PROTECT YOUR MICROPHONE EVEN IN 5 KNOTS. You can see the texture of the water to determine how much its blowing and hear these people testimonial. But again the best thing will be for you to try the kite and see it for yourself. Any way , one of the Canon G15 cameras I was using did not have a case that protects them, so the microphone was totally exposed to any thing that hits it. Even your breath can make it sound like 30 knots. I am sure you know what I mean. Their was barely any breeze out that day as you can see from the video, so I did not have any reason to use a case to protect the microphone on this camera which I never use for videos. But did not realized it will make so much back ground noise even in 7 to 10 knots. This is why you don't hear that noise in some other footage, because I was using my GOPRO camera with its case until the battery died. So I took the Canon G15 camera to continue filming. So if you know about cameras and have filmed before with out protecting your microphone, 4 knots of wind can give you this type of noise as a background. This is the reason why film makers use a type of protector on their mics to reduce the noise. But if you are in door, then no need to protect your mic because there is zero breeze coming across the mic. Personally, I only use the case that the GOPRO comes with when filming outdoors in order to reduce all that windy noise.
The other reason is that 10 knots isn't really that light of wind. Most of us call in sick to work to 10 knots here...
From these videos, is it safe to conclude that the Infinity v3 doesn't have the low end grunt of some of the other kites? In 10 knots I would want to see someone riding a SS Asylum and throwing jumps and unhooked tricks. Mowing the lawn on a lightwind board or surfboard is not what most of us what a light wind kite for. Also, how does it do when there is 3 - 4 feet of chop. Ocean riding takes quite a bit more power. My feeling is that it takes 12 knots to ride this kite in the ocean on a "normal" twin tip.
Well Mr.we, it all depends on the kiter's ability and also the conditions you kite in. In 7 to 11 knots I am able to do a lot of fun things on the INFINITY v3. Or else I would not of introduce this model to the public. So if you have the skills to kite in 7 to 10 knots then demo any of these light wind kites and see which one is best for you. Me personally if it is blowing 12 +++ knots I use the SCREAMER 14 with my Twin Tip in flat water or the RENEGADE 13 with my surf board or the SURF 12 kite with my surf board depending what I am in the mood for and the conditions. Now if you are 240 +++ lbs (7 to 10 knots) might be on the low side for you. But again kiting in 10 knots it's not fun for everybody. Me it's part of my job so I can can push the envelop and come up with some great products and share it with you guys.
Wow is what I have to say when you are calling sick into work for 10 knots! Either you have lighter winds than we do (and I doubt that) or an overabundance of sick time. Here in Ontario if it is over 20 knots than you are unwell as those turn into epic sessions!
soul19 wrote:Wow is what I have to say when you are calling sick into work for 10 knots! Either you have lighter winds than we do (and I doubt that) or an overabundance of sick time. Here in Ontario if it is over 20 knots than you are unwell as those turn into epic sessions!
That's because you don't have a lightwind kite!
Having the right lightwind gear really does make 10 knots enjoyable. Its fun in a different way than a day jumping big on a 9m kite. Our local spot is usually choppy, but at 10 knots it can be mirror flat. Lots of fun cruising around at 20-25 knots on the raceboard.
Roger at 230 lbs said he "actually had a pretty good time flying the kite" .... "I went upwind fine on it"...."I liked the jumping on it - was pretty good".... ' loftier...a little floatier hangtime than I was on the Flite' - in 10 to 11 knots on a 165 by 48 board.
I think that's quite a positive review in those areas.
Hi all, Just checked this thread after a while, and I thought I should comment regarding Epic and dealers.
Dimitri does do a lot to help us out as a dealer, refers customers and has even sent me demo kites to help out, but it is a two way street, if he can see you're doing your best and working hard to promote the Epic product then he bends over backwards for you. The team is always easy to contact, and quick to reply. Very good support in my opinion.
As for the V3, every kite isn't everyone's cup of tea, just try and get a demo or get to demo days to try as much gear as you can. I've taken the same approach as Dimitri and send demo kites around, as I think you get a better idea kiting at your local, in your own time with your mates and can pick your conditions.
Anyway, the idea is to find the right kit for you, we're all different.
I believe the actual review has been lost behind all the needless defense. So here is it again in summary.
In lighter winds, 9knots and below the Infinity wants to pull you down wind and it is hard to hold any line. 10-12 knots it's a decent kite with plenty of power and starts to ride upwind better. 14 knots and up the kite gets overpowering and is not as comfortable to fly.
Dimitri's videos just reinforce all of these points.
The point why we don't recommend this kite in light wind is because there are kites that you can ride upwind in less wind, and ride past 13-14 knots and still be comfortable and having fun.
Most people are not going to buy a large light wind kite and then have a 14m kite also. Bigger guys will have fun on their light wind kite until the wind is too much and then will ride a 13-12m kite.
You could go out and get a C-kite and probably get just as good performance in the small wind range of the Infinity, without the good relaunch of course. And guys who's style would compliment the infinity would probably be happier with a c-style kite.
They were talking about how they were getting big air in 10 knots back in 1999, so in our opinion the Infinity, which when it came out in the beginning had speed on the bigger light wind kites, now really as nothing to offer different that other kites now do better in a bigger range of winds.
ORSales wrote:Hello Epic Infinity thread! Long time listener, first time caller.
lobodomar wrote:No innovative light wind technology in neither the Contra nor Flite... OR dumped the 4 strut concept and the "venturi system" (now that was supposed to be an innovative technology...) Light weight bladders, thin struts, everything has been available for a while.
Unfortunately, this statement is misleading. We are one of a very few brands lucky enough to have a full time, in house designer working on kite designs and even luckier to say that he's been our in house designer for over 13 years. There are very few people in the industry with Ross Harrington's kite design pedigree so, while there is no new "technology" on our Flite light wind kite this season there is absolutely new and novel thoughts that have gone into the kites' design.
When designing kites it's obvious to say the 1st consideration is the desired flight characteristics and expected use conditions. For light wind kites we see these kites typically operate with very little wind and they are expected to perform over a very limited wind range, typically about 8-20 knots. Whereas a high performance kite like the Razor will be designed to operate in higher wind conditions, over a larger wind range and will therefore be subjected to more dramatic changes in the angle of attack.
This newest generation of Flite was designed with a much longer cord and thicker air foil. Combined, this creates a stable, easily controlled kite that is not prone to stalling. The Razor has a much shorter cord and flatter air foil, making it a more responsive, fast flying kite that operates over a greater sheeting range and therefore needs the added security of the vents to offset the chance of a stall.
What's more, the Razor has a much higher initial angle of attack built into the kite whereas the Flite does not, again making the vents unnecessary additional weight on the Flite but crucial for the Razor.
As Dimitri has said a few times here, I also encourage you to try a kite before you buy it and am delighted to tell you to contact the guys at XL for a demo or your local dealer. With over 13 years experience in the industry and a stellar track record of both customer support and innovative, thoughtful design I would hope you'd consider Ocean Rodeo for your next kite but ultimately encourage you to ride any kite that works for your style and preference, so long as you're on the water and smiling. Trolling the internet is just plain boring.
See you on the water!
You are some of the guys that make it happen, and I admire you for that. But I don't expect you and your team to get it right every single time, and neither should you (OR dropped the 4 strut vented light wind kite concept, and that's a good thing). And you should not expect kiters/customers to believe everything they are fed up with, that would be even more boring than trolling on the internet.
Lobodomar, sorry for the delay in responding, I was out of the office last week skiing.
Not sure how I offended you? If I did, I apologize... I certainly wasn't trying to feed you anything (except possibly some bacon and maple syrup).
The fact is that when we designed the 1st version of the Flite it was the best light wind kite we were capable of at that time and it incorporated a different design philosophy than this year's Flite. It is still a good light wind kite but we have learned a lot since and are damn proud of the new Flite which is currently receiving such great reviews.
The Venturi design remains a key part of our overall design strategy and is a key feature in this season's Razor which is our high end, most aggressive kite. You'll see it is also a key feature on the Storm which is a kite designed to operate over a massive wind range.
Some kiters love to know the details of why a design was implemented vs another option, others just simply care if the kite flies well or not. I suspect you are the latter of the two. I love to know the details and am usually quite happy to try to help explain them here, which is what I was trying to do with my post. I certainly didn't mean to sound like I was defending our choice to remove the vents from this year's Flite. Rather, Ross took an entirely different design tact with this year's kite and it's clearly paid off.
Here's Ross explaining his philosophy for this year's Flite: