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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 1:50 pm 
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Location: Ontario
Hydroflex looks like the way forward. Preserves the simplicity of custom shape and glass construcion that sandwich, parabolic rails, moulds etc over think.

If others can copy the process that roots glass fibers deeper into the foam, and we get away from it being proprietary, there might just be a future for cost effective bomber strength light weight lively flex boards that can be churned out by custom shapers. Who knows, maybe someone can even make em so we can recycle em when their toast.

The pump thing is a little gimmicky, but it would be nice to be able to push water back out a ding. Could also reverse the pressure to suck a bit of resin in to seal cracks pretty easy. Also nice to take some denting out of the deck, though If your certain not to get a delam (like that glass structure seems to accomplish) it would be easy enough to take out most heel dents with a hair dryer or hot water. Heat does a great job of re-expanding EPS foam to its original shape.


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 7:19 pm 
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What about the new I foam that rawson is using in his new boards liKe the ones bws is selling.
Supposedly the foam can compress and then expand all on its own kinda like memory foam. Seems flukey but it's pat rawson who knows a thing or 2 about building surfboards.

Back on topic
I have owned FireWire,surftech tuff lite, many poly boards broke em all currently on a surftech tl2 and it's great it should have died long ago but seems to absorb impacts better than most. The tl2 construction doesn't have the sheet foam like tuff lite or FireWire but has extra glass to make up for it but still no stringer resulting in more flex I think it's different foam also. I put a glass patch under foot to help with heel dents which I have found adds a lot of life to any board.


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 9:33 pm 
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Funny you should mention TL2. I just had to open, fill and patch my TL2 Surftech. The foam under the front heel had compressed and not rebounded, yet the epoxy skin held it's shape and delaminated away from the core. This made a void. Dunno how much water that core can absorb, but just that space itself was too much to leave it alone. Big nasty job. Boo TL2. I have another board of the same shaper in his Marko/Epoxy layup and the skin stayed bonded to the Marko foam under that front foot spot. All I had to do was patch over it. Seems to me that delamination is the enemy, and TL2 did not stay stuck to the foam. So no more TL2's for me. Having said that, the rest of the board has held up just fine. Had I pre-patched under the front heel spot, the board would have been in better shape. The board rides great (Stretch F4). Nathan is a real badass eh? I figure if he can ride the board in Macking Chopes insanity, I can putt around in waist high mush. Still, I reckon I want my next one in Marko/Epoxy or Hydroflex.

I say we tow the Mighty BM into one of those Tahitian Bombs on his Tufflight Fish after 10 or 20 bong-hits of that Olympia Medicinal. He could show the local boys whats up.


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 11:29 pm 
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heavy - strong - light snap

my experiences so far

keen to try new wood firewire with wooden sidewalls


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Mon Apr 14, 2014 12:25 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 12, 2008 2:46 am
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Location: San Diego
I have owned the FireWire and the surftech type board. I have had the same issues that everyone else had where it started to delaminate. The surftech board was fine for a while, until I started jumping with it, after a month of that I had cracked it five different places. I now just use both for surfing.

So I started looking for something strong and light, I decided on a Libtech Ramp surfboard which is 5'7" long and weigts 6.2 bl (2.81 kg) without fins. This is my low wind surfboard. I've had it for 4 months and I've been jumping a lot on it, in flat water and in waves, so far no delamination, cracks, or dents.

This is what they had on their website:
"LIGHTWEIGHT POWERPOP AIRSPRING CORE
Our exclusive closed cell alloy formula will not absorb water, is springy like a trampoline, contains up to 50% recycled content, and uses ozone friendly blowing agents. All offcuts go back into the process of making new blanks. This is a new formula that didn't exist a year ago.

2D2D VOLCANIC ORGANIC BASALT HONEYCOMB TECHNOLOGY
Strong, light, lively, impact resistant, resists heel dents, additive free, volcanic organic pop. Damn Difficult 2Ding!" Here is the site's link: http://www.libtechwaterboarding.com/technology/


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 1:58 am 
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Old 2010 video but helped me understand hydroflex construction, plus bufo should have been a villain in die hard movie



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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Thu Apr 24, 2014 9:03 pm 
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wondering if anyone has an idea of the weight of a hydroflex XXX they under the 6lb mark?
seems like a cool idea, but I would imagine the "3d glassing" isn't terribly light.
compared to something like HD foam.


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:45 am 
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johnny,

read my post on page 1. Very light and strong, extremely ding resistant. 5'10 Roberts Ill ,pads, fins and all sub 3kg. Only marginally heavier than my BWS Mulcoy Pro which was ridiculously light but a lot stronger. used to repair it every couple of months, but after a 100+ my Hydroflex looks like new.

Mike


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 3:25 pm 
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mike dubs wrote:
johnny,

read my post on page 1. Very light and strong, extremely ding resistant. 5'10 Roberts Ill ,pads, fins and all sub 3kg. Only marginally heavier than my BWS Mulcoy Pro which was ridiculously light but a lot stronger. used to repair it every couple of months, but after a 100+ my Hydroflex looks like new.

Mike


Cool thanks Mike under 3kg all in is awesome!.

I've been looking extensively on how to make boards stronger and lighter and have come down to the conclusion that you need to resist heel denting to maintain structural integrity of a board in buckling failures and delamination.

The 3d foam addresses the delamination, as for buckling, without heel dents the amount of load required to buckle the board stays high.

However most lightweight composties don't really have enough energy absorbtion characteristics in order to absorb the energy of a kiteboard landing without plastically deforming the underlying foam underneath...unless of course you just throw a lot of weight at them .

I've been chasing some light weight springy core material to allow differnt skin materials to deform a little and absorb more energy without deforming the underlying structure......Something like air is ideal......No weight.....non linear spring rate..... except it would tend to want to delaminate the skinz, which he's got under control with his "3d glassing technique" which anchors the the lamination over a higher area.

THIS IS A BRILLIANT DESIGN....

I've built some some pretty awesome boards over the last few years in the quest for board magic... and after a boat load of testing, ended up with something alarmingly similar to firewire's FST construction as the best I've done thus far

I like the hydroflex design concept so much I'm probably just going to buy one for my next board and see where they stand up compared to my super labour intensive projects.

Not sure how they stand up in real life (so far sounds good) but after 2 years of measuring and smashing test panels the concept of pumping the board is not gimmicky in my opinion.

As a way to change flex and ride characteristics for surfer it seems pretty gimmicky.... but to prevent denting and the weakening of the board as a result from ktieboarding the pumping concept is very solid and brilliantly executed.


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 Post subject: Re: ranking surfboard construction Firewire/hydroflex/surfte
PostPosted: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:15 pm 
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Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2009 10:28 am
Posts: 289
The pumping does push out the dents, and the way they do the glass means it wont delaminate, it also helps keep water out if you hole it. I don't pump mine as I do prefer it flexible. It does stiffen it, one day I pumped it to 6psi and it was rigid and rattled my teeth, let all the air out and then smooth as silk. I sent a message to Patrick Rebstock who told me he rides with 0 or 1/2 psi. I have ridden mine hard 100+ sessions, washed up on stony beaches, blown down a beach in 50mph, and jumped/landed hard and it looks great still! Best board I have had for the combination of ride/weight/robustness and will only get these from now on. I normally change boards every 6/9 months but absolutely no need with this one.

I think they are strapless kitings best kept secret! Real Watersports stock a few and they really rate them too. This is the only board I have ever had that I would not hesitate to recommend with no caveats!

Mike


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