*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Fiberglass bridging problem with a vacuum
PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 3:29 am 
Offline
Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:16 am
Posts: 336
Location: Perth, Australia
^^
Amen to that. Thx


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Fiberglass bridging problem with a vacuum
PostPosted: Fri May 23, 2014 11:37 am 
Offline
Rare Poster

Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2009 3:43 pm
Posts: 24
Sometimes small problems that eventually you over come are really not problems if you change your construction style. It might seam to be a big deal but usually in the end it will take you to the next level.

Jim


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Fiberglass bridging problem with a vacuum
PostPosted: Sat May 24, 2014 8:36 am 
Offline
Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:43 pm
Posts: 349
Location: Iv.G.-Slovenia
IMO the gap @ the bottom of the taper comes from bridging, although 2 piece (moving core) can also add a bit. So, solid, one piece core is the base.
Taper shape consistency/quality is very important. The surface of the taper has to be flat!!! You can get best results by pulling the top core part along a fixed sanding belt at desired angle.
What worked best for me (when vacuum pressing) was steeper taper angle (60-70° od oka), no round @ the top (just remove the sharp edge). A consistent round-out at the bottom of the taper is very hard to do even with a filler, so it might just f*** you later and you have 2 steps more (also sanding). Most important here is how you do the layup! Cambered edge is much harder to do without having air gaps, so I avoid it.

Layup:
First part is not so relevant as the second, but it might help.
I lay down a clean plastic film (PVC) on a flat, clean (no dust, shawings,...) surface. Than I started with peel-ply and FG sheets on top, align them, smoth them out, than soak with resin, and smoth it down a bit more, to get a compact sheet.
Than I soak up the core (since it has a bit of rocker already I put wooden blocks under the tips to prevent it to flex later, so the FG stays in place during layup).
I get help (far less air pockets). We grab the plastic film and invert it on the core, starting from the centre. A third person to gently apply presure (smoth out) while you are slowly lowering the film is a great +. The tricky part is to remove plastic film since resin creates a bit of vacuum. You have to be very slow. Use help to pull the film and you hold down the fibres, so you don't pull them from the core or ''delaminate'' the FG and Pealply sheets, because you would get airpockets to deal with along the way.
Second part:
I use my bare hands (with gloves) and a credit card. You have to do this as perfect, as you were doing a hand layup, and you will get great results. First smoth out the fibres on the top surface with your bare hands, starting from the centre out also forcing excess out.
Than lift the laminate off from the lower core surface and wiht your other hand tapp with your fingers on the taper surface starting from the top edge down and do this along the taper. Than do this again with a card, but not with tapping. Just slowly and gently smoth down the sheets.
Than push the card in the corner (where you got air pocket) and tapp with your fingers and smoth out the sheets from the card (which you are holding) out, and work it along the taper. Repeat the smothing out with card (2nd one, or just push down with your fingers @ taper). Be carefull how you are removing the card. If you pull it directly off and far worse, if you tuch sheets with the card's surface, you might pull it off and create pockets. Slide it along the taper while lifting.
At this stage you should have a perfectly hand layedup board. Check for any potential dry spots and apply some resin if needed, otherwise (gently :D) throw your board on rocker taple, breather or watever on top (same procedure along the taper (lifting breather from bottom surface))..... and do your vacuum set up. Usually no additional smothing out is needed after applying pressure, but if not, use a card, not to create bridging with pulling cloth out.
At this stage I asked myself WhyTF do I even need to vacuum? Just to f*** with vacuum setup and leaks and stil not sure what's the result beneth the breather? Yp, I started pressing and also got rid of breather and peel ply and introduced plastic top sheet, which adds to durability, however turns on the head the complete above mentioned process.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Fiberglass bridging problem with a vacuum
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 4:16 am 
Offline
Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 01, 2013 7:16 am
Posts: 336
Location: Perth, Australia
Cheers Zob

I like the "od oka" - "by the eye" method:)

In the view of the above comment, was changing your tech. from a vac to a press, the next level of board building? A higher, a better level?

D.


Top
Profile
 Post subject: Re: Fiberglass bridging problem with a vacuum
PostPosted: Mon May 26, 2014 12:02 pm 
Offline
Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2009 1:43 pm
Posts: 349
Location: Iv.G.-Slovenia
downunder wrote:
was changing your tech. from a vac to a press, the next level of board building? A higher, a better level?


I wouldn't put it exactly like that.
Since I had to do a "perfect" hand layup to get as best results as possible, I only needed second stage pressing to get the rocker hold it's final position (small forces needed) and to get most of the access resin out and consequently get smoth surface (higher forces needed).

You know what's the finish from peel-ply like (need's sanding, hot coating), and I also got a zig-zag patern from the breather, since it had denser zig-zag pater on not so dense base. This left a lot of excess resin (but with a patern :D). Since I got rid of the brather there was no need for peel-ply either. But I couldn't squeze out as much resin as I can with pressing, so this was the way for me to go, and I end up with a glossy finish, so after laminating I am realy close to done, which was not the case with peel-ply. And I avoid Vac. bag leaks and other issues.

So I would say I went for a simpler method, which produces better results :D .


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 25 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group