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Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

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joyrider1
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Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby joyrider1 » Fri Jul 03, 2015 10:58 pm

I am a fan of learning new things step by step. This mostly helped me a lot.

So here is another idea but I haven`t tried it yet on the water: Just mount the mast under your board just without the wings. This way you should be able to train the new and different feeling of leaning, rolling, jibing, yawing etc. without having to deal with pitch at the same time. Just don’t stand too aft but more forward on the board. When you are comfortable riding this way you might have better/safer success with actually flying with the wings mounted…. Maybe this idea doesn`t work at all, but I haven`t read or heard about something like this so far…

Other tipps or "step-trainings"?

Ride safe and have fun

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darippah
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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby darippah » Sat Jul 04, 2015 12:08 am

Great idea it's been done before. May as well do it with the fuse and rear wing , it shouldn't give any lift and make it more like foiling without making it too hard

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby jplmain » Sat Jul 04, 2015 10:51 am

I new a friend who started teaching foiling. He decided too take the front wing off and leave the back wing on. That was a disaster. The mast broke right off the plate (I won't tell what brand it was because he bad and got a warranty replacement).

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Hawaiis
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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby Hawaiis » Sat Jul 04, 2015 11:59 pm

I don't think removing the front wing caused the M brand strut to snap. It is more likely due to poor quality.

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby windmaker » Mon Jul 06, 2015 7:08 pm

Hawaiis wrote:I don't think removing the front wing caused the M brand strut to snap. It is more likely due to poor quality.
Exact, besides this kind of breakage has already happened on foils flying both wings.

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby jplmain » Mon Jul 06, 2015 8:42 pm

But why take the chance. You would think the added leverage forced on one angle would without the other would create unneeded stress. But I know lets try experimenting with your foil. :rollgrin:

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby joyrider1 » Mon Jul 06, 2015 9:46 pm

I expect not only total beginners to benefit from this to ride straight directions. If you had a wider or floatier board which is not too raceboard like it should be easier to train also jibes and tacks with the mast only at lower speed? At least I want to try that….. And I expect things like downlooping the kite while jibing etc. to be easier learnt. (Downlooping was not a standard maneuver for me until foiling) Or downlooping from toeside to heeside jibes. Maybe I want to try my first foil rides in (higher) breaking waves with mast only…. And so on…. I think this all will train you to keep your body nicely in line with the mast. High speed rides with such a big “fin” may be no good advice….

My time on the water is extremely limited so it will take some time until I can give some feedback :thumb:

jplmain wrote:The mast broke right off the plate .
IMO every well-built mast should easily take the stress from a beginners` ride leverage… with or without the wings on.


Have fun and ride safe

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby Hawaiis » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:37 pm

They probably had a bad batch from having too much beer down at Puerto Rico.

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby borist » Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:45 am

joyrider1 wrote:I expect not only total beginners to benefit from this to ride straight directions. If you had a wider or floatier board which is not too raceboard like it should be easier to train also jibes and tacks with the mast only at lower speed? At least I want to try that….. And I expect things like downlooping the kite while jibing etc. to be easier learnt. (Downlooping was not a standard maneuver for me until foiling) Or downlooping from toeside to heeside jibes. Maybe I want to try my first foil rides in (higher) breaking waves with mast only…. And so on…. I think this all will train you to keep your body nicely in line with the mast. High speed rides with such a big “fin” may be no good advice….
I'm highly doubtful of the value of this approach. The reason is that the board with both wings will ride differently even while touching the surface. Foil helps the board to "plane". Which is why you can ride them in very light wind with relatively small amount of kite pull, even when going at slow speed. "Drag" from foil disappears as soon the board gains little speed.
Trying to ride a board with mast only or mast, fuselage and the back wing will offer no lift and all the drag, even at higher speeds. I'd imagine one would need a bit more power to make it work. So quite a different sensation.
Perhaps it could be tried with a beginner who struggles for too long with just getting on the board. For most, if it helps at all, it might be useful for first 2-3 water starts.

To have an appropriate type of foil and board to learn on and learning in the right wind/water conditions is MUCH more important.

My 2 cents

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Re: Foil beginner idea, mast without wings

Postby joyrider1 » Tue Jul 07, 2015 10:12 am

Yes, depends on the conditions… mast only should have less or no benefit at all in low winds. (And my gut feeling tells me, if you have no front wing, then leave the rear wing also)
But if you have mid/high winds or difficult conditions the mast only step could give you a huge boost within 30 or 60 Minutes or so…. In combination with a kite size that you don’t have to sinus and that has good depower you could try to ride mast only at slower speed controlling your body being in line with the mast and controlling your speed with sheeting the bar in and out. Just what you might want when foiling. Well, I did.
Looking back at my very first foil session I would have been very happy not having to fight this foil “beast” in 20 knots and choppy water with wings on. Of the total of 60 minutes I only was above water line for max 3-5 minutes, not a single second foiling…frustrating then. After a similar step training on day two then on day three I was foiling distances of hundreds of meters with very little touching water surface.
Just my experience…. And after all we made it somehow to tame the foil beast more or less :D

Have fun with whatever beast you ride :thumb:


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