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Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

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Starsky
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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby Starsky » Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:54 pm

I feel the same way about the race phase, but it was a necessary step to shed all the crap ideas that were more fancy than physics. Even the race scene went through some growing pains with complex wing curves and have now settles to by and large much flatter simpler wings than three years ago. Racing helps distill the body of knowledge. Then you can start to get back to some of the less race oriented qualities in foil design idea without getting draggy components in the design.

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby juandesooka » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:17 pm

Makes sense. I should also add, I learned on an original carafino and have since gone on to Stringy wings and DIY canard/spitfire. A massive difference between the carafino and the stringy, even if the stringy are considered big surface area, medium AR, and slowish compared to race wings. I traded off with the friend who bought my carafino one day, and was shocked at how slow and draggy it is ... also realized the stance on the board is wrong, feet too far back, explaining the leaning back "water skiing" effect riding it. Definitely an important step in the foiling history, but for sure the modern foils have advanced beyond it, even the slowest and lowest AR are likely more efficient today.

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby Starsky » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:23 pm

And you give Philippe Caneri no where near enough credit! He still has the best ever foiling in true curling waves clip on the internet. I kind of have to resent windfoiling for stealing his focus. The H14 will be on the top of my list, that is if they ever make one.

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby BWD » Tue Jun 13, 2017 8:32 pm

For spreading the feeling of the fun of foiling I give credit to Greg (and his brother, who makes the videos), and to the Caneris, a similar situation.
Horue have beautifully shown the full dimensions of foilboards (still waiting on a surf specific one though...), with French style and bikinis added for seasoning; the Drexlers have shown how to do more with less fuss, and find a whole new style that is not based on "highest" tech or "fastest" performance, but just uses foils and strutless kites to have more fun and expand the idea of what kiting can be. Pretty cool :thumb:

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby plummet » Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:59 pm

I think racing/competition is required to progress and publicize a sport. Without competition foiling is a niche with in a niche. Once the development of racing and extensive coverage occurs many people can see the advantages where previously it was literally just a few weirdo's doing it. Also for the most part people are sheep. They will follow what's "on trend" Racing brings the trend and the sheep follow accordingly.

My conclusion is that racing bought foiling into the main stream. Now we see it develop into the various areas.

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby windmaker » Wed Jun 14, 2017 6:23 am

Peter_Frank wrote:
Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:07 pm
I have followed the hydrofoil history since the very start in the early 2000s mostly protos and a further development of the AirChairs for wakeboarding.

And now I have noticed something:

Back in 2007 Carafino made the first "public" kitesurf hydrofoil which were marketed worldwide.
Bought my first foil from Carafino summer of 2oo5...

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby Peter_Frank » Wed Jun 14, 2017 9:13 am

windmaker wrote:
Wed Jun 14, 2017 6:23 am
Peter_Frank wrote:
Mon Jun 12, 2017 7:07 pm
I have followed the hydrofoil history since the very start in the early 2000s mostly protos and a further development of the AirChairs for wakeboarding.

And now I have noticed something:

Back in 2007 Carafino made the first "public" kitesurf hydrofoil which were marketed worldwide.

Bought my first foil from Carafino summer of 2oo5...

Yes, there were earlier models too indeed :thumb:

Around here in Europe it was around 2007 it went "viral" and all the world I think, suddenly knew and could see there was a relatively affordable good hydrofoil that worked with straps instead of boots, so eventhough a slow start it was THE start IMO, at least here.
It took years, and as said, the French are the reason why they are common today, in the performance (race) concept that made it huge and interesting for everyone, but also the freestyle and beginner concept that are quite close to the origin of the first good Carafinos back then, thats why I say "Back to the roots" again almost a circle, an interesting 10 year journey :naughty:

Many others has contributed loads yes, without getting "bad" later, but it does not change the history what we like and dont like - but putting known things together and making a concept that works so well and gets known all over the world not the least, is a huge achievement no matter what, and where it slowly started to escalate at first, taking a journey around top performing foils, and back to the first ones (almost, of course they are better now, but still close to the very same AR and concept and board).
It might have been different in different parts of the world, but it was how it was and is around here.

This was my point with this post, not whether we like or dislike or hate some, but an observation about the trends now :wink:

8) PF

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby BraCuru » Fri Jun 16, 2017 3:58 pm

Hope Moses would reproduce the cult FR425 & FR450
So far no better for waves for me :)

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby Tone » Fri Jun 16, 2017 4:38 pm

Mongo was a big part of the sport, no one took that from him apart from when he was saying he was the start of the sport.

He had a sellable product but obviously had major issues.

The French, in my eyes were the pioneers of the high performance foil. The american's took that into the racing scene and made is more popular (even though it was popular in France) and thus the racing scene moved along.

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Re: Back to the roots of hydrofoiling ?

Postby Bille » Sat Jun 17, 2017 7:19 pm

Kamikuza wrote:
Tue Jun 13, 2017 3:14 pm
Starsky wrote:
Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:20 pm
You miss spelled loser
And mast
And Mast --- :lol: ; not everyone will Get that one !! :thumb:

Mongo wanted to ship me to where he worked, and teach me how
to use a hydrofoil , (way back then) when he was first selling his
devise !!
I should have taken him up on it ,because at the time i knew more
about production composites, than most in the kite boarding industry...
and things May have turned out quite differently , (for him). :(

A note to builders :
there is a way make a rather Cheap but high quality mold , (.007" tolerance)
that can reach 300-F, (148-C) , without the need for placing it in an autoclave.

Doing that means you can now mix the epoxy you'll need for the next 2 months
and per-saturate your roll of carbon and pre cut all your parts needed for the
next 2 months, then place them in a refrigerator for later use ...
and that cuts down on a Bunch of man-hours labor because cutting 6 parts
is just as easy as cutting one . You can't really pre-cut a dry fabric because
the cut sides will fray and unravel at all the edges ; and then there's that exothermic
thing that makes a builder want to mix only 100g of epoxy at a time thing.
Without a heat-able mold, on a production line with 4 guys working ; one of them is
mixing epoxy all the time for 25% of your labor.

Bille


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