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Kite sizes beginner's question

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sergei Scotland
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Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby sergei Scotland » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:27 pm

Hi,
Another beginner's question :-)
At the moment I have a 10m Blade but as I am heavy guy (95 kg) I need to add a bigger kite sooner rather then later.
Most people seem to have kite sizes in progression of 2m:
i.e. 8m 10m 12m
As a beginner - I kind of do not see the point of havin kites which are so close
because:
1)kite pull is proportional to square of wind speed and only(!) proportional to size of the kite (not square of the size).

2)So a to a 10 m kite will produce the same pull as 12m kite with wind speed only (square root of 1.2 = 1.1) 10% more then needed for 12m.
Or to rephrase - a 12 m kite will allow you to kitesurf with speed of wind only 10% less then a 10 m allows.

So for me a 10 m needs at least (say- roughly) 22 mph and a 12 m will be able to pull me at 20 mph.

Or to rephrase - if I currently need say 22 mph with 10 m
and
I want to be able to kite at 18mph I need roughly(!)
(22/18) * (22/18) * 10m = 1.22*1.22*10 = 14.9 m kite (!!!)

Do you know what I mean?
I suspect that going in kite increments of 2m does not really make sense ( around 10 m size anyway)
as the wind envelopes of the two kites will overlap to such a big degree that you are not gaining much in "combined wind envelope".
I.e. bigger kite will not help you if wind drops 15% as you would need 1.15*1.15=1.32 times bigger.
And 15% of 22 mph is only 3.3 mph

In the view of above I suspect that I do not want 12m in addition to my 10m but need to jump to 14 m instead.
Or may be 13m?
What do you think guys? Does this make any sense to you?

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby jeromeL » Wed Sep 06, 2017 1:48 pm

It depends what you want to do with kite and local wind condition. In general I agreee that in bigger kite size you can increase gap, for example a lot of people hav 12 and 17 or 10 and 14. But most common size are 9 and 12 in my area.
If you need to be well powered but not overpowered then might make sense to have an 8,9 and 10.

Personally I think I'll be pretty happy with 8, 10, 14 quiver.
I feel like a lot of 12m days I would be happier on 14 or better off slightly under on 10.

Over 12m kite starts to become pretty slow, so if power is only criteria then go bigger, if you don't want to sacrifice playfulness or kite then go with smaller increment.

I would ask your local group what a good light wind kite is for your local condition, though being heavier you probabaly want to try.

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby badgb21 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 2:00 pm

Hi Sergei,
Hope your learning is going well.
I’m sure you’ll get every possible answer there is for this, but here’s my 2 cents.
Firstly, need assume we are comparing same style of kites, as power difference can be huge for same sqm.
As a learner power is your friend, most need a lot of power to keep momentum going from starting.
So yes, you are going to need a bigger kite.
Depending on your weight, the winds you kite in and other factors like sea state, you are likely to find 2m between certain kite sizes to be a lot. However, at other parts of your kiting spectrum 2m won’t feel like much.
For me 10m to 12m is a world of difference compared to 13m to 15m

I would advise a little planning of what winds you want to kite in, the style of kiting and the amount of gear/budget you want to allow.
Eg. 2 boards & 3 kites, moderate winds – freeride. Or if you want to travel, you may need a bigger range of gear, similarly if you have long spells of light winds in your area. For most of us we want to go kiting when we have free time, so a good range of kit is going to allow you more chance to go out when you have the time.


Assume your 10m is a good kite – this is because it is now the datum, then you need to plan around this.
Guys around you weight I have kited with would maybe have 9/12/15m Kites, hence your 10m makes your planning slightly different, maybe 8/10/13m. Many don’t like to go for big kites and in Scotland (assume that’s where you live) you will be blessed with plenty of wind!
Let us know what wind range and style etc. you want to aim for and hope I can be a little more specific.

Here’s a thread with a great graph of wind/kite size, by Peter Frank:

http://kiteforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2368840


Kev

sergei Scotland
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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby sergei Scotland » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:26 pm

Kev wrote:
Guys around you weight I have kited with would maybe have 9/12/15m
Thanks for that, this kind of supports my idea that 3m increment seems sensible?

For me my 10 is my "smallest" kite really for my weight (I do not plan kiting in 27-30 mph!), so I actually need 10/12.5/15.

If I stick to 2 kites then 13 seems to be sensible choice then with 13 m would be my main kite really.

I will not have real low wind of 15m covered but oh well... :-)
My problem is Blade Trigger does not come as 13 m (12/14 only). I kind of like Trigger and have Blade Unibar V2 for it... :-(

I guess I will need to check wind envelops of 10 and 14 to see if overlap is enough for comfort?

sergei Scotland
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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby sergei Scotland » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:32 pm

jeromel wrote:
Personally I think I'll be pretty happy with 8, 10, 14 quiver.
Thanks jeromel,
What is your weight?

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby badgb21 » Wed Sep 06, 2017 3:42 pm

Blade Trigger website has a size weight calculator, I have no idea if accurate but assume it to be ok.
10m 23-28knts
12m 19-22knts
14m 14-18knts

10m to 14m looks a big jump. If you buy a 14m you might not use it until the summer.

Buy a 12m now and maybe a 14m later- 2m gaps and that's how they get ya!

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby EricSanders » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:02 pm

I'm about the same weight and I have to agree with you.
I have a 7-10-13.5-17 quiver.
7-Blade Trigger
10-LF NRG
13.5-Best Kahoona
17-Blade Fat Lady.
In our area, we get a lot of 13-20 mph days that my Fat lady is very happy in. If the wind is more consistent, 18-22, then my 13.5 is more comfortable since I don't have to worry about the lulls. I break out the 10 when we are seeing 20-30.
Eric

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby knotwindy » Wed Sep 06, 2017 6:09 pm

Yup, think most would agree with you
smaller kites, smaller gaps
larger kites, larger gaps
Sort of trying to keep the percentage of change similar

So an example would be 6,7,9,11,14or15

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby dazarter » Wed Sep 06, 2017 7:36 pm

when a blade trigger has a range from

14m 14-18knts :o buy something different...

my gaastra pure 2016 in 13 QM goes from 12 to 24 at 80 kg..... i thing the 14 to 18 knots cannot be true its a really small range for one kite - nobody has such stable winds - i would be always changing my kites


i run an 8 - 10 - and 13 qm - now im really happy with my range on mostly a twintip - somethings a waveboard in the lower wind range 10 - 15 knots.

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Re: Kite sizes beginner's question

Postby dazarter » Wed Sep 06, 2017 7:46 pm

8 - 10 - 12 is really a perfect combi with a 15 as well is more than perfect.....

i ditched my 4 kite set up 7 - 9 -12 - 15 because i was sick of carrying my gear around. two kites will be more than fine .....3 to 5 is really perfect.

At 95 kgs a 13 or 14 will be your main kite and a 10qm your second.... for me a 10 qm ist the perfect size - quick but not too quick, small. light . just nice to use - thats way i went back to 8 - 10 - 13 because i missed my old 10 qm..... a 9qm is not the same .......a 10 and 11 qm kite has a massive range my kite (10 gaastra pure) goes from 15 to ca. 35 knots in gusts with a problem - jumps like a dream with a lot of hangtime.....(board 142x42)

a friend of mine also 95 kgs has an 8 . 10 . 14 range and he also would not want to miss his 10qm kite.... the 8 qm kite has be used once! but that is on a twintip - using a 2 board range 136x42 and 145x45


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