*


All times are UTC + 1 hour



Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 76 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Simple spinning frontline leash, almost invisible
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 11:51 am 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2185
Location: Spain/Italy
This system is based on ideas and systems that other kiters have kindly shared.
Thanks to them.

Overview of leash
Image
Image

The bungie leash is the standard slingshot leash with one knot in it to keep it tight even with the trim pulled down.
When you spin the bar the leash sometimes wraps itself around the depower a little but as soon as you pull the bar down the shackle spins and lets the leash untwist.
You could probably eliminate this by putting a plastic sheath/pipe around the leash but it isn't a problem for me, the leash is always free I've found.
I used 27m frontlines and 23m backlines because I like long leaders on the backlines but you can also use a line set of the same length, the leaders of the brake lines are more or less the length of the depower + trim + Y so you can use a longer trim and/or Y if you want longer leaders on the backlines, this will also make the leash longer though.
Leave some knots on the backline leaders so you can lengthen the backlines to trim the kite down in strong wind because you can't shorten the front lines anymore except with the trim.

After a rotation you get this before you spin the bar back to untwist the lines.
Image

I haven't got a stopper ball on the leashed line because the ball would be above the twists and might not pull through properly. There are no leaders with knots on the leashed line for the same reason.

Spreader bar and shackles
Image
Image

I found that one line in the wichard (unless it's threaded through the back like the flimsy standard line I ditched immediately) can move and you can find it at the bottom of the trigger where it's very hard to release the shackle. To solve this problem I used one piece of line through the bottom of the wichard, (where I don't want to apply force to trigger it) and put this through a bit of plastic pipe, the leash shackle goes on this, it's tight so the bottom of the trigger is always occupied and you can't try to pull here when you trigger the shackle. Then I threaded 3 pieces of the same line through the shackle in front of the trigger
(above the bottom fixed line the leash is on). There are knots at both ends so you can trigger it whichever way it's facing and puling on a knot means 3 lines are activating the trigger.
I used a small plastic ball on the leash shackle so I could feel the difference between the knots and ball without having to see them. The ball and knots are small so they don't catch in the spreader hook causing accidental releases.
I tested both shackles for release with my own bodyweight, probably not enough, aparently a kite can put as much as 4 times your bodyweight on a shackle. The wichard 2673 releases really smooth when you pull a knot towards you (but not by pulling down, sideways or forwards) with all 3 pink trigger lines pulling on the trigger, releasing every time from the plastic depower. The side release shackle releases from the steel ring although this needs more force when under traction. To release the wichard you pull one of the knots towards you, which seems quite a natural movement, it releases immediately. To release the leash shackle you have to pull down hard.

Y with swivel to let frontlines twist
Image

The leashed line is free to pull through the ring, no knots, no stopper ball.
Be carefull when making the Y, at first I just looped a piece of leader line through the swivel on the trim but then I noticed that the leash might catch in the loop of leader between the swivel and the knot where the top arms of the Y branch out. Watch for this and anywhere else the leash could catch when you release the depower.

I've tried this on land and in the water and it seems to work fine but that doesn't mean it'll work fine for you, feel free to ask anything but please test your own system on land and in light wind (both under traction) before trusting it because different parts act differently.
Please note that I am not doing a shitload of rotations yet and if you only do tricks rotating one way and do lots of them the Y and swivel may not keep up with you and keep the fronts untwisted so watch the Y and if the leash ring and front flying lines start twisting together start doing tricks the other way or spin around in the water to untwist them because the leash might not work like this. A better swivel will probably spin better.

All the best winds
Jo


{ SHARE_ON_FACEBOOK } { SHARE_ON_TWITTER } { SHARE_ON_ORKUT } { SHARE_ON_DIGG } { SHARE_ON_MYSPACE } { SHARE_ON_DELICIOUS }
Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 2:15 pm 
Hi Jo,
Nice pics and great effort but I thought shackling direct to the plastic tubing of the chickenloop was a no-no!! :?: :?: :?:

Anyone else of the same view?


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 3:08 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2003 3:07 pm
Posts: 684
Location: Netherlands
Great system! :greengrin: Just cut the plastic tubing of the CL and you've even got a better system. But does the swivel really turn back when you're untwisting the lines? Cause that's why there were "developments"regarding no load swivels for the leash, or better bearing swivels or two frontlines. Just curious how does it work really regarding spins (and spinning the bar back, offcourse :P )


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 6:15 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2185
Location: Spain/Italy
Hi guys, in the tests I've done a side release shackle catches almost every time on the plastic chicken loop but the wichard seems to release fine, I'm not saying do it this way, some people say a ring is better. The most important thing is to test it and if it works, ok.
About the spinning, like I said the leash does seem to wrap a little around the depower but as you move the bar up and down with the leash and depower in tension it seems to sort itself out making the shackle turn. It would probably be better with a stiff plastic sheath over the leash and I might add one later. I don't know if you always ride with the bar fully depowered.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 6:46 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 5596
Location: Denmark
The risk with the plastic loop is, that when it is under load, it get pinched "long", and when opening the wichard - the square tip edges can in very very rare cases get caught and be "hooked" into the plastic - so it does not let go !


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 7:02 pm 
enough Bitch'n about the damn plastic on the chicken loop! this is the same leash system that i use and it works very well.


Top
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 8:43 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Mon Aug 26, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 2185
Location: Spain/Italy
Peter_Frank wrote:
The risk with the plastic loop is, that when it is under load, it get pinched "long", and when opening the wichard - the square tip edges can in very very rare cases get caught and be "hooked" into the plastic - so it does not let go !


Hi Peter, yeah it's right to warn people about this and because some work ok doesn't mean all will but I've tried this under traction and even squeezing the chicken loop (pinched closed) around the shackle and the tip of a side release shackle will almost always catch in a plastic chicken loop while I've never had the wichard catch so I do trust it. But because it works for me doesn't mean it's ok for everyone, I do think everyone should test their own system definately. There's also a groove on the end of the open wichard which I think could catch on a ring, not as big a groove as on the trigger wichard but it's there all the same. That's why I decided to use the plastic chicken loop with the wichard, also many other people say it works ok and I think the general opinion is that the side release shackle needs a ring while the wichard works ok without one, that's what I understood from all the discusion anyway. Mel said plain rope with the wichard but I didn't fancy that because I thought maybe some strands of the rope might catch on the groove and the rope can wear more.


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 9:15 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Sat Jan 25, 2003 1:00 am
Posts: 894
Location: Paname (suburb)
The answer is a "METAL RING", definitively! Image


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 9:40 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 16, 2002 1:00 am
Posts: 5596
Location: Denmark
The "Groove" as you say, is what locks up in the plastic loop !

In a ring this cant happen.

And even with a piece of rope, the strains will be cut if they should catch, so it still releases - unlike the plastic which will hold on (to the groove...)

That why I think a ring should be preferred.

The problem is, that you can not test a system yourself - one has to look at all others experiences, as you must have an idea of the worst situation (that maybe won't happen in your tests).

And now we are at it - I've heard about one accident where the plastic did not release from the Wichard tip/groove...
Is that the only known case, or have it been seen by anyone else ?


Top
Profile
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2003 9:56 pm 
Offline
Very Frequent Poster
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2003 3:07 pm
Posts: 684
Location: Netherlands
So the system works like this?

http://www.kitesurfing-kiel.de/safety/wichard/wichard.avi

But then with the y, to allow some twists?


Top
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic
 [ 76 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ... 8  Next

All times are UTC + 1 hour


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot], DionisKiter, jespin4845, MKM, Okinawa Kiter, t3rse, Xtream and 18 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group